cycling tank with shrimp

[Mikester311]

So far my 72 gallon tank has been up for 5 days or so and the 5 shrimp that are sitting on the bottem of the sand bed are starting to decompose. The shells of the shrimp are all fuzzy and swollen. The Ammonia level is about 4.0... After 3 days I turned the wet/dry on. My questions are: Do I leave the shrimp in the tank. Take the old ones out and replace them with new ones? Should I take all the shrimp out except for one to give the bacteria something to munch on? How high will the ammonia go and when will it start to drop? Before I put the shrimp in, I put in a fresh bed of arogonite. I waited a day and put the srhimp in and ever since the tank has been cloudy. How long does it take to clear up?

Thanks!!

 

[Mikester311]

^^bump

 

[Tybond]

This is different....

First, how exactly is your tank setup?

How deep of a sand bed?

Did you add any live sand or just use dry?

How much Live Rock?

I would pull the shrimp out if I were you (HOLD YOUR NOSE!)

If you have plenty of Live rock and such, your cycle should be well on its way.

I won't try to illaberate on anything yet, We need to know what all you have for a set up.

ty

 

[Mikester311]

Right now I have about a 3 inch bed of dry aragonite sand I got from purearogonite.com and that's pretty much it. I was told not to put live rock in until the cycle is complete because everything would dye off on it.
Your right, the shrimp stink. I never thought I would be going through so many air fresheners. lol

thanks!

 

[rexxx]

:evil: why in the hell would you subject shrimp to a cycle?there are so m any other ways to do it.this method is way old school .h

 

[Tybond]

Hey rexx LIGHTEN UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1


This is a very common problem.

People are just doing what they are told to do when it comes to setting up a tank.

I believe what mike means is he added dead shrimp to his tank.

Mike, I'll get back with you on this.

It's in depth and will take a while.

If you want, Email me at [email protected] and we can discuss your setup.

Yes this is very old school. There is alot of info you need. The setup your are doing is just not going to work for you.

Please dont take rexx the wrong way on his reply. This type of thing makes us all mad because it is such a problem. Not on your part but on the part of the fish guru you listed to.

I'll get back with you here when I get home from work or like I said, drop me a line and we'll get into all the details one on one.

PULL OUT THE SHRIMP!

Its just going to make a stench!

ty :wink:

 

[M.E.Milz]

Rexx, I am sure that Tybound is correct in that DEAD RAW shrimp are being used to cycle the tank.

Tybound, I am not so sure that this method is "old school", although I am not so sure that the technique is being implemented correctly.

I have recall reading other threads where it has been suggested to bury dead, raw shrimp IN the sandbed to promote the rapid population growth of sandbed fauna. However, this probably won't work unless you have the right type (grain size) of sandbed, and unless you seed the sandbed with either live sand or live rock.

 

[Mikester311]

I have seen posts on many different forums that say that this way to cycle works the best and your not risking loosing damsels left and right durring the cycle. From what I have read in other posts, you put the shrimp in, wait until the ammonia peaks, then take the shrimp out? Here is an article that I sort of followed. http://fishwhisperer.homestead.com/articles.html
I'm not sure how "old school" this technique is? A lot of people seem to still be usinmg it. My problem is that I'm not sure of all the little details that I mentioned in my original post. I did take the shrimp out yesterday and they did stink!
This is my second time around setting up my tank. The first time I filled my 72 gallon with straight tap water and cycled with damsels. After many damsels dyed off and I started to get crazy alge blooms many people on these forums told me to filter my tap and go with the fishless cycle using dead shrimp. I just want to try and get it right this time around.

 

[M.E.Milz]

As I understand it, you are using decomposing shrimp to start the ammonia/nitrite/nitrate cycle. I have no experience with this approach since I live rock for this purpose. In any event, I would suggest testing the water. Once you have measured the presence of ammonia and nitirites, and then subsequently have measured zero for both, you initial cycle should be complete and the rotting shrimp no longer serve any purpose - remove them.

Of course, you should be aware that anytime you add something (fish, live rock, etc) to the tank, you will cause another mini-cylce. As the bio-load of the tank increases, the magnitute of these mini-cycles decreases because of the increased level of bacteria already in the tank.

BTW, what I was referring to was the use of rotting shrimp to increase sandbed fauna, something that is quite different than what you are trying to do.

 

[esmithiii]

I, too have heard of using dead shrimp to jump start the cycle, even though I myself have not used that method. I used my LR to cycle the tank, which is IMO the fastest and most sure-fire way to start the cycle. When you finally add the liverock expect another small cycle as any dead or dying organisms decompose in your tank.

As for the shrimp, you only need a little bit to start the cycle. Three is TOO much! Take out all but like a quarter of one. I would add the liverock once you have zero readings on the Ammonia and the nitrite tests. Usually the cycle takes roughly a month.

Ernie

 

[Mikester311]

What do you guys think?
Right now my tests read:
PH - 7.8 (I guess I need to take it up a little)
Ammonia - 4 ppm
Nitrite - 5 ppm
Nitrate - 20 ppm
I'm guessing these will all drop in time. I just didn't expect them to all be so high all at the same time.
btw. I took all the shrimp out, so right now my tank is just running through the wet/dry and sitting on a 3 inch bed of aragonite. Will my cycle complete at this point? Or did I jump the gun by taking the shrimp out? I get so many different opinons fom everyone which I think is great but, some people say it will work. Some say it won't...Some say add live rock, some say don't.. I just want to know what is going to work for me and give the best results without having to start over again.

Mike

 

[danmhippo]

Whew, it's a good thing you took the shrimp out now. (BTW, how does it smell?) 8O

The cycle will be over as soon as nitrite and ammonia falls undetectable. You should do a large water change (say, 30%) afterwards (cycle completed) to dilute the accumulated nitrate. You may want to do a couple of these water changes to bring NO3 down below 10ppm.

Are you planning on putting in LR? If you are, it is a good time to do so now. If you wait till your tank finished cycling, as soon as you put a shipment of LR into the cycle completed tank, the whole cycle process will start again, and you need to wait another 3-4 weeks for the ammonia and nitrite level to fall within acceptable range ("zero", that is).

FWIW, LR that comprise of about 2/3 of your tank volume should take over your tank's dependence over wetdry. You may want to consider that too.

 

[Mikester311]

How much LR would you recommend putting in my 72 gallon tank right now?

 

[danmhippo]

Go with about 50-70 lbs of LR or porous base rock, whichever you would like to work with. Remember to get rocks as porous as possible to allow more surface area per square foot of rock surface.

 

[Mikester311]

50 - 70 lbs now? That seems like a lot to start with. Plus that's a lot of $$ to dump right now. Especially at the LFS. I thought you were suppose to start with a little bit to begin with and add slowly? You guys are the pros though. That's why I am here. For the expert advise.

 

[danmhippo]

Let's say you add 15# of LR now, you need to wait for the rock to cure in your tank, that's about 2-4 weeks. A month down the road, you add another 20#, yet, another cycle started. This time not only you need to wait another 2-4 weeks for the rocks to cure but you are also stressing whatever you've already put into the tank.

It's going to be a lot easier on you (your time and your fish) if you can get the curing and cycling process done at the very beginning of setup and get it over with.

Yep, that's a lot of $dough$, welcome to the money pit!

 

[SPC]

Posted by Dan:
It's going to be a lot easier on you (your time and your fish) if you can get the curing and cycling process done at the very beginning of setup and get it over with.

-Well said Dan.

-Mike, if I were you I would drive to Tampa Bay Saltwater on a Saturday and pick out my rock.
Steve

 

[Mikester311]

Steve/Dan,
You guys have a very good point and you are the guru's. With everything else I have invested, I really just don't have the cash right now to spend on 50+ lbs of live rock. Do you you really need to put that much live rock in the tank if it's not going to be a reef tank? I still have the wet/dry for filteration.
I will take your advise steve and take a weekend to drive out to Tampa.

 

[SPC]

Posted by Mike:
Do you you really need to put that much live rock in the tank if it's not going to be a reef tank?

-The method most use now Mike is a deep sand bed and live rock. The reason for this is that it will accomplish all that is needed in the nitrogen cycle, ammonia - nitrite - nitrate. The problem with a wet dry is that it gets to the nitrate stage and can't go any further due to aerobic conditions, so you are left with having to deal with the nitrates in some manner.
Steve

 

[esmithiii]

The way I did it (and I would do it again) was to add all the liverock at once. I recommend 100lbs of rock. I would order it online and have it shipped. This will save you lots of dough in the long run.

Ernie