high pH -- how to stop!

[dallast1]

my pH has been increasing steadily over past month. I do dose with kalkwasser as my makeup water. i perform, at a minimum, monthly 20%-25% water changes.
recently have been adding baking soda to bring pH down. but this works only temporarily. my pH is now regularly between 8.5 - 8.9.

any ideas on what's going on here? need some feedback!

thanks,

dallast

 

[boris MAC]

Dont do that any more , maybe for a while soda will bring down pH but that is bufer , for a while will speed up your pH. That is main reason why you have such a high value. Decrease lighting, feed your fishes a litle more than usualy and maybe for a short time you will have readings of 8.2-8.5

 

[leftovers]

an even simpler method would be to keep everything the same lighting wise and stop adding additives. No more kalk or soda and let it be it will come down slowly and safely.You are subjecting your tank and occupents to wild swings in ph and i bet your alkalinity is through the roof.

left

 

[Anonymous]

Welcome to reefs.org, dallast.

Generally, Sodium Bicarbonate is used to bring pH up, not down. It's also used to buffer, yes, so as boris noted, it will increase your alkalinity and make it even more difficult to bring the pH back down.

What I'd like to know is why you were using the Soda Bicarb in the first place, are you having trouble with fluctuations?

 

[Anonymous]

Washing soda bring the ph down.

 

[Anonymous]

Washing soda...where you from? :lol:

Guess I need to reread my recent readings...:? Thought for sure it was the other way 'round....what would ya use to bring it up, then?

 

[Anonymous]

It has been along time since I dealt with my high ph problem. One brings it up, while the other takes it down (baking soda vs. washing soda).

Perhaps my memory fails me?

Which is correct? I surely don't want to give the wrong advise!

Louey

 

[Anonymous]

WHAT??? Oh man, now you've confused the bejesus outta me! (easily done, I assure you..:lol: )

Lemme go back to the chemistry calculator, hell, I might even just ask Bob or Jason or someone...:lol: Help meeeeeee!! :lol:

Sorry, I'm not the one who needs help here.

dallast, I see you double posted this query, and in the other post some others bring up some VERY good points, not the least of which is if they animals appear to be doing alright, slow down, be sure you're tester/kit is properly calibrated, and go slowslowslow making pH changes.

 

[Anonymous]

I use Washing Soda to raise my pH.

I've never had a high pH problem, just the opposite. I have heard of people using distilled vinegar to lower their pH though. Do a search here or look in the Advanced Aquarist online magazine.

 

[Anonymous]

Correct again, Yance, however, using vinegar won't help to buffer the water in the downward mode, so it's really easy to end up with the pH bouncing, which is far worse than letting it remain a bit high.

 

[leftovers]

again do nothing. stop adding kalk and anthing else. Recalibrate your ph meter if you are using one and just wait. Test you alk and see where it stands. If you feel you must dose add 1/4 of whatever you were before. You should be able to go several days with out making additions and your pH should drop naturally.

Backing soda boostes alk, washing soda boosts pH. If you add them to your tank to maintain alk and pH you should mix them 1 to 4 or 5 washing to baking. You can read more from several of the online chemists and ro articles.

 

[Anonymous]

Since you seem to know the difference between baking and washing sodas, can you please tell us what washing soda is? I know that baking soda (known by more than a few chemical and common nomenclature terms) is Sodium bicarbonate. But I've never heard of washing soda, so I have no idea what it is.

 

[Anonymous]

According to my box of Arm & Hammer Super Washing Soda, it's Sodium Carbonate. I bought mine in the detergent aisle at Smith's.

 

[Anonymous]

http://www.chemistrystore.com/sodium_bicarbonate.htm

 

[Anonymous]

yeah, that's baking soda but who needs that much? heheh

 

[Anonymous]

Seamaiden,

Washing soda vs. baking soda. One is sodium carbonate, the other sodium bi-carbonate. One raises ph, the other lowers it. I can't remember which. Arm and Hammer makes both. Baking soda is obviuosly in the bake good section. Wash Soda is in, well, the washing section . Really. Not many stores carry it though. I bought a box a couple of years ago, but only one store in town carried it.

I hope we are all thoroughly confused now. :wink:

Louey

 

[boris MAC]

It doesn't mater how you call it because it is still consiest CO2 (bicarbonate) and doing the buffer job
Dosage: 1/4 tee spoon 50 galons, and you should have set up pH to 8.0

 

[dallast1]

thanks for all the input, guys! much appreciated!
as many of you suggested, it was the blasted ph meter (which i just calibrated a month ago). was a goodfull point high! so now, the actual ph is about 8.05, which is not bad (but not great).

so have continued with kalk dosing. no immediate jumps in ph yet. i fear that the buffering capacity of my minimal sandbed may be depleted. i say this not from current situation, but from longstanding low ph, no matter what i add to water to buffer.

due to design flaw on my part, i have limited options in adding, say, a refugium or deep sand bed. perhaps i shall take some photos and post. see what people think i can do with my minimal space.

dallast

 

[mgk65]

To be clear:

Washing soda (sodium carbonate) has an immediate, significant, pH raising effect along with a strong alkalinity raising effect.
Baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) has an immediate, slight pH lowering effect along with a moderate alkalinity raising effect.

Both of these will reach an equilibrium after some time, say 24 hrs.

The only good store bought washing soda is Arm&Hammer Super Washing Soda in the United States. Canadians, don't use any kind, as they have some other undesirables in the box.

If you cannot find washing soda, you can make some by baking baking soda at 250 degrees F for about 1/2 hour.

You guys need to read some articles in Advanced Aquarist:

How to Select a Calcium and Alkalinity Supplementation Scheme
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/feb2003/chem.htm

Solving Calcium and Alkalinity Problems
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/nov2002/chem.htm

Calcium and Alkalinity Balance Issues
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-04/rhf/feature/index.htm

Calcium Carbonate as a Supplement
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/july2002/chem.htm

The Relationship Between Alkalinity and pH.
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/may2002/chem.htm

Solutions to pH Problems
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/june2002/chem.htm

mgk

 

[Anonymous]

Dallast, I just noticed that you're in Las Vegas. Do you go to the LVMAS meetings?