Mechanical Filtration?

[Frontosas]

Hello All,

I'm new to SW and could use a lot of help!

I'm keeping a FOWLR tank in a 55 gallon w/20 sump (hopefully).

I'm reading everywhere that mechanical filtration (such as foams) are not necessary. If so, how do we get rid of medium/large debris?

Thanks for the help!

 

[Anonymous]

This is true. If you have adequate amounts of live rock and sand they will be the filter themselves. However they dont get all the solids in the water. In cases like this you have a few things you can do. You can invest in a filter sock (they come in various micron size) and clean them regularly, or you can do as I do and use a sort of filter mat in your drizzle box either way they need to be cleaned atleast once or twoce a week to maintain their effectivness and keep your nitrates down. If you have LR and a DSB some methods of Mech filtration actually work against you. Deitris gets caught in it and unless its cleaned by you has no where to go thus building up nitrates and you dont want that

 

[tenshi]

I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but I find that my protein skimmer removes some of the debris and detritus that are in my tank, although it doesn't remove all them. I frequently find pieces of nori and brine shrimp I feed my tang and that he misses in the protein skimmer's cup. Not only that, but when you remove this small pieces of detritus completely from your water cycle you avoid this particles from decomposing and ultimately becoming nitrate which slowly build up in your system. Yes the live rock helps remove nitrate from your tank, but I find that the nitrate to nitrogen process is slower than the detritus to ammonia, ammonia to nitrite, and nitrite to nitrate process. So, slowly your nitrates accumalate with time, making for the need for water changes more frequent. For this reason I find a protein skimmer essential in todays modern marine system. I'm sure someone else will tell you the cons of having a protein skimmer soon (which include removal of essential minerals from you system) and say that a eco-sytem type mud system is better suited to the removal of nitrates. That's my two cents or as others say IMO.

Tenshi

 

[Anonymous]

Agreed. I am curious, though, about your nick. You're an African cichlid aficionado, ain't ya?

 

[Anonymous]

I never ever run a tank without mechanical filtration. I am surprised how many people don't. Now I can see why they have such a problem with Nitrates. This had me puzzled till now.

 

[Anonymous]

People can get into nitrate problem with and without mechanical filtration. The fact that you do and does not have nitrate problem, and the fact that some of the others don't, and have nitrate problem does not mean that mechanical filtration has any direct effect on nitrate.

More often than not, nitrate problem is due to nutrient import such as feeding and topoff water quality. Nuitrient export such as mechanical filtration does not play as significant role as protein skimmer for most cases.

 

[tenshi]

I think that those that are having nitrate problems in their systems are due to the two reasons David mentions and one other. Over feeding, poor water changes/top-off water replacement, and over population in the system. Let me explain why. Over feeding: any uneaten food doesn't just magically disappear, it stays in your system and decays, in the long run this will become nitrate which slowly builds up in your system. Water changes/top-off water replacement: most water supplies contain a certain amount of nutrients, minerals, and compounds, this is why we use RO/DI systems, to get rid of unwanted stuff in our water (I just recently bought a TDH meter and relized that my home RO unit wasn't doing the job I thought it was, so I added a DI unit, now the TDH reading is 1-5ppm when it used to be 52 after RO, oh yeah I also got my cities water supply report and was surprised to see that there was quite a noticable amount of nitrites and nitrates in the cities water supply). Over population: If we over stock are tanks, then the bio-load that are critters poop and pee has become part of our nitrogen cycle/biological filtration bio-load, if we overwhelm our biological filtration then how will we reduce nitrate. Bangbang thinks that his mechanical filtration is the reason he doesn't have a nitrate problem. I don't see how that could be because the bio load that his filtering out is still in his water supply but just concentrated in one area, his mechanical filter. It still decomposing in there and once the decomposition starts its released back into the water as ammonia. Once ammonia, no mechanical filter will be able to remove it from the water supply as it goes through the nitrogen cycle. Yes bacteria colonize his mechanical filter, but the bacteria that convert nitrate into nitrogen live in oxygen poor enviroment. No mechanical filter can provide that that I know off, live rock and our DSB provide that oxygen poor enviroment. Bangbang I'm not attacking your idea, its just that the way I understand the nitrogen cycle, it does not compute with mechanical filtration, unless your cleaning off your mechanical filtration of any decomposing material every day. Bangbang can you explain your theory of how nitrates are removed through mechanical filtration and maybe I'll learn something new.

Tenshi

 

[Anonymous]

I make this very short. A mechanical filter needs to be rinsed of solids and/or changed frequently........otherwise like you said the nitrate will still be an export problem. I don't like canister filters for this reason. They are a pain in the butt. I like the hangons..like Aquaclear. Easy and inexpensive....for tanks up to 100 gallons. Works for me. The proof is in the water. Ok .....Ok....here is an example.......My Great White and 9 baby pups in the 5 gallon bucket constantly needed mechanical filtration. I had to pick the waste out by hand every hour ..it was and is alot of work but really keeps the Nitrates to a minimum. :lol:

 

[mountainbiker619]

My only mechanical filtration is a 100 micron sock that resides in my sump being fed from the overflow unit.

 

[ynd]

Hey guys, I'm new to this reef aquarium thing.
Let me get this straight, It is best not to use mechanical filtration at all? i.e. water goes into sump, thru skimmer, then pumped back to main tank? (Tank has Live Rock). How about Activated Carbon? Is it neccessary? Thanks guys.

 

[tenshi]

I personnaly don't run activated carbon, although many other reefers do. Some run it continiously, and some run it on a monthly basis. Some people run mechanical filtration, but like Bangbang has mentioned on this thread, you'll have to clean out that mechanical filter quite frequently. I don't use a mechanical filter at all. The only filteration going on in my tank is going on in my DSB, Protein Skimmer and Live Rock. My nitrates are never to high. 1-5ppm. Everything looks great and if it's not broken why fix it.

 

[ynd]

Rity O then. Sounds like a fair answer tenshi. If it works, why not.
What if you don't have a DSB, I only have a thin layer of CC, bout 1-2 cm, 21kg/45 lb of live rock and a skimmer for my 42g corner tank. Is that enuff so you don't have to use Mech Filtration?

 

[tenshi]

Alot of other reefers are changing their CC for a DSB, mostly cause they're saying that it contributes to high nitrates. I personally don't have any experience with this cause I started out with a DSB. If you have a typical 42g tank that measures around 24 inches wide and want to change your CC for a DSB you would need about 45 pounds of sand to create a 4 inch deep DSB. Here in the states alot of people use a play sand that they get at a hardware store called Home Depot. It's a specific brand that I can't remember off the top of my head. The reason they use a specific brand is because its somebody tested or something and it doesn't have phosphates or silicas or something like that. I personally used CaribSea Seafloor Grade Argonite. Argonite is suppose to help with pH and Alk. I picked it up for about $20 to $25US for a 40 pound bag at local fish store. I think that if you plan on keeping coral and just one or two fish then you should be OK with your current set up. But if not then, I would add the DSB. Hope this helps and I'm sure others will put in their two cents soon. Hey you know what else I just thought of. You live in Australia, what keeps you from going to a secluded super clean beach and picking up some sand from there. Just a thought. I would never do that myself since I live in Houston, Texas, and the only local beach around here is Galveston's. And the water there is as brown as mud because of the sh** we put in it. What do other Reefers think of this?

 

[ynd]

Ok, thanks Tenshi. Yeah I only plan on keepin two clowns, and coral, and any reef janitors that I need.
Hopefully the clowns will breed = )
I only just set up my tank 2 weeks ago, so I don't think I'll be changing to a DSB anytime soon. I currently have a sponge in my sump (for mech filt) but plan to remove it once the tank has cycled, thanks for your "two cents worth" Tenshi, appreciate it.

 

[ynd]

Hahahaha...good idea Tenshi, but Aus beaches are not that clean hahaha. I once used to get water from the beaches, full of disease which killed my fish, so I'm steerin away from natural resources =)
Also I read somewhere that beach sand is not good for reef aquariums? plus its illegal to take = )