My Noob Perspective... 6 months in.

[qqfob]

Hey Guys, I'm 6 months in...

Some Thoughts

1. Cycling is a waste of time... true, take it slow, but these bacteria in a bottle, esp Special Blend, is the best stuff ever. ONE piece of cured live rock, and the rest dry from Reefcleaners.com

2. I currently have 20 fish, since January, I have lost 15 fish through various reasons: Emerald crabs, Coral banded, shipping, overheated qt tank, unknown dissappearence, jumper, incompatibility, and I just straight up flushed my 2 Chromis' when I ran outta room in the first tank. < 50% death rate... how am I doing?

3. LEDs... hands down. Electricity went up 20% for my 2 story house even with LEDs, I can't imagine MH or any other lights. My light cycle also stays on till midnight to double as a night light, then the sump light takes over.

3a. Yes, longer light cycle will grow unwanted algae, but that unwanted algae also reduces nitrate, so do yourself a favor and start growing that coraline asap.

4. LFS: Aquarium Villiage, Coral Theory, that little basement place on Kissena Blvd. Online: Live Aquaria, Vivid Aquariums, Reef Cleaners. My friend Jason (info edited - KC)

4a. Unless you go to the above mentioned LFSs, bring your smartphone, or someone with a smartphone. I won't mention names, but I've been sold a second basslet, a non reef safe fish, stuff destined to die, and even some dead stuff.

5. Go with the biggest tank you can fit in the location you want, or else you're just going to upgrade. Oh and put it by the couch, at least somewhere with a chair you can sit back, smoke and relax to.

6. I do a water change once a month. I check all my perimeters also once a month, prior to the water change unless something big just died. Stop trying to scare noobs away saying saltwater is high maintenance. My dogs take more out of me than the fishtank.

7. Acrylic and sand does not mix. Esp if your Pistol shrimp likes to play Jenga.


The Start

I started this hobby in December of last year, got my first fish right after new years, that makes me a veteran Noob at 6+ months. So far, this hobby, the pets, the people, everything had been great to me, so I thought I would share a little bit of what I have gone through, and share what I have learned, and maybe in the process get more advice.

Last year, a few of my friends had gotten planted fresh water fish tanks, which introduced me to the "relax" state of this hobby whenever we're over at someone's house hanging out. Once in a while, I see them working on the tanks, aquascaping, which is something i thought i would enjoy since i love building and arranging stuff. However, I was told weekly water changes and trimming of the plants were required. Wow, that sucks, not for me... lol

I'm a really active mountain biker, and just so happens, around that time, I bust my a$$ and fell upon a cute little frog, a spring peeper. I've always had pets, and i bet I can get a tank for it easily, so I took the little guy home and the next day my friend delivered a 20g breeder for me to mess around with, a planted vivarium. $50 at Home Depot and a day later this, little did I know, was the start of the hobby.

My first tank, 20g Breeder for my frog

A spring peeper is a good start, but doing more and more research online had me looking to buy a pair of Dart Frogs, and build something nearly impossible without spending a fortune, lol, like this...

http://s102.photobucket.com/albums/m98/qqfob/?action=view&current=a7aa8e60.jpg

So I began looking around LPS, local pet stores, and more and more I see these COOL looking "exotic" saltwater fishes, corals, invets, tanks... and while there are a million pet shops in NY, only one said they can get me dart frogs. He said, plant your tank, and come back we'll order it. Okay, find a tank. A week of searching on Craigslist later, I found me a running 40g acrylic SW system with sump and skimmer for $300... wow, $300 and all I need is fish!? I'd prob spend double that building a planted viv, with waterfalls and plants, then screwing it up and doing it over again... LOL

$300 I have this system in my living room, but within hours I noticed I should redo the plumbing, valves, need salt, rocks, grr... so a quick trip to the LFS cost me another $300 on the first day... before fish. Wow, but NOW I'm ready... so after a rush week of cycling I got my first 2 Chromis' on Jan 2nd. Another week later got me a Black Cap Basslet, another week got me a Peppermint Hogfish, then a mismatched pair of Clowns. Yup, 6 fish in the first month, oh I thank the industry for bacteria in a bottle.

First week of my 40g Acrylic, still cycling

At this point, I've started talking to my friend Jason again (edited - KC), and started to learn more about what I've gotten myself into. $300 gets me a powerhead and a T5 and I'm ready for corals. At the end of the second month, I'm a 10 fish, and packed with corals, inverts, pretty much anything I can buy between Live Aquaria, Aquarium Village, Coral Theory, and misc...

Slowly getting there...

... and Nitrate that won't stay below 40ppm. Only way out without getting rid of anything, obviously, is a bigger tank. Then comes this forum. Manhattan Reefs. Dude you guys are EVIL. 72gal bowfront that only takes up a foot more space for $200 with stand? LOL. free 30gal to build a sump? nice. Then... $300 more for bigger pump, plumbing, and a used 250g skimmer. Needless to say, lots of $ invested, but well worth it.

My 72g Bowfront. The idea was to maximize sand space and have room for corals up high

Another month, another upgrade... LEDs. SPS left and right. The names you guys put on this stuff is rediculous. "Godzilla Staghorn", "California Dreamer"... lol. "Darth Maul Zoa" "Alien Brain Maze".

First was a dimmable LED strip, proper placement allowed for some SPS

Then I got hooked on LEDs. The actinic is so nice... an Ebay purchase got me more.

We are almost up to date, less than a month ago. Thanks for the compliments.

I started dosing calcium twice a week since I got into SPS, but LPS grows faster. I was told my water has too much nutrients... so... more macros! And we are now up to date. Next, a better skimmer...

$100 worth of weed so I can keep enjoying my tank

And the story will continue. I am hopeful that the spending will slow down at some point, but even if it doesn't, I can't wait to see my tank after year one...

and now, some of my favorite pieces

Main display rock. Cali Dream, Gorilla Stag, Tricolor Valida, Ultra Pink Milli, Danae, Orange Birdsnest, Ice Fire Empanada, some Montis, you tell me the rest.

and some RIPs...

 

[NYreefNoob]

ah, where to start

1. Cycling is a waste of time... true, take it slow, but these bacteria in a bottle, esp Special Blend, is the best stuff ever. ONE piece of cured live rock, and the rest dry from Reefcleaners.com

so not true, there is no way to istantly cycle a tank, i dont care what bacteria in a bottle your using, a tank will cycle for years, and after you have 5 years or so you will soon realize this.

you have animals in there that are doomed to die.

more light = more algea = a good thing ? thats a new one on me

doing water changes once a month is more then likely why you cant get your nitrates down, that and too many fish and leaving the one's that die in there for others to eat, plus more then likely a cheap skimmer

dosing calcium twice a week ? how much do you dose ? and how did you figure out the amount you needed to dose ?are you checking alkalinity and magnesium also ?

all those wrasse's in there hopefully the tank is covered

and I just straight up flushed my 2 Chromis' when I ran outta room in the first

so sad

50% death rate... how am I doing?

horrible

sorry and i dont post much anymore, but it is these type of threads that have people thinking this hobby is easy, and same reason so many people fail, keeping something alive for a month or two is not success. 6 months isnt even a noob veteran, thats the first stage of a cycle for a tank, and seeing you switched tanks that started all over again. do wish you the best of luck in the hobby

 

[nanoreefer22]

You honestly flushed fish? Maybe you're in the wrong hobby

 

[roc5288]

This has to be a late April fools joke.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Widdy]

Nah, it's a troll plugging his friend's business.

 

[KathyC]

Nah, it's a troll plugging his friend's business.

Not anymore - that info was just edited out of the thread.

You honestly flushed fish? Maybe you're in the wrong hobby

+1

 

[JimmyR1rider]

Spoken like a TRUE NOOB.... A noob that will most likely have issues because he relies on bottles of miracle cures for each problem he will eventually have.

You've lost 15 fish in 6 months I 've lost less in my 3+ years.

3a Makes 0 sense so grow that coraline? Coraline grows on it's own with balanced water paramaters. Not like a plant in a garden that you plant seeds and water them and make sure they are in the sun.
Phosphates along with light grows green hair algae.

Smoke and other things that effect air quality and add extra Co2 will effect your ph, due to lack of oxygen


You're six months in and you test your parameters once a month? And you're asking about dosing twice a week?

Where's the "relax" that your friends taught you? Sounds like that got flushed down the same toilet as your 15 fish.

So all in all if this is in fact not a joke and you are completely serious about everything you stated you should keep all of your extensive knowledge that you've learned in 6 months in that half empty head of yours.

Also before you try to plug or mention stores especially one that has a good reputation make sure you're not spewing assenine non-facts for for eveyone to see.

Take care and best of luck I hope your toilet doesnt clog with the next batch of fish you flush for stupid reasons. By the way hows it feel to be a member of a forum that 100 different people would have taken those chromis but you killed them to make room?

One day as little as those fish were they were still lives that you chose to senselessly end and will have to answer to someone for it. Hopefully he will have room and not flush you to the much warmer place that has no a/c.

 

[Killarsox]

This has to be a late April fools joke.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

I'm thinking the same thing.

This thread will surely make the hall of shame.

 

[James]

Unfortunately, i don't think this is a joke. There are a few people who started out like this on the forum and ended up not half bad reefers (Inneed comes to mind, remember his posts about getting some stingrays and other stuff in a 125?). The reason they made it is because they listened to the good advice of the vast majority of this forum and weeded out the bad advice they got. OP, I agree with one thing you said, mainly that this hobby isn't that hard.... but for different reasons. If you PROPERLY cycle the tank (and understand what a cycle is and why it is so important), export more nutrients than you import, properly stock your tank and do timely maintenance without getting lazy, you can easily have success (btw, testing monthly when you don't have a good grasp of water chemistry is a bad idea).

Good luck,
James

 

[roc5288]

Just to piggy back at what you said. Zukas thread started crazy and he is very good at this hobby now.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

 

[James]

Roc, I missed his start but heard something about it, and yes he knows what he is doing. Unless people are abnormally stupid (actually more rare than you would think), it is mostly just an issue of misinformation and ego getting out of control, once someone rectifies those things, they can be fine with this hobby. The trick as a forum is to not bash these people but to help them with some patience (as hard as it may be) because that is what will save the animals in their path of ignorance, brow-beating them just makes them stop posting and they will continue the killing.

 

[MeanGreenEyes]

You honestly flushed fish? Maybe you're in the wrong hobby

+1

Incredible and I don't mean it as a compliment...you really need to do some research before you kill anymore livestock...if you're willing to just "flush" fish you really are in the wrong hobby. We are aquarists not just b/c we like to look at fish in a glass box, but we genuinely care about the livestock that we place or plan to place in our tanks. We also do proper research on that livestock to ensure that it's a proper fit in our systems. I don't usually comment on threads like these, but I'm shocked at how carefree you are at just carelessly killing livestock. You should really take a trip to the beginner's section and read it thoroughly before you do anything else to that tank, especially dosing. Stick to weekly water changes in the meantime and ask for help, use the search function or google. None of us are perfect, nor did we start the hobby as instantaneous know-it-all's but you have a lot of research to do before your tank crashes all together. Smh

 

[qqfob]

I guess internet forums will be internet forums...

Thanks for all the support, James, because these other guys simply doesn't know how it feels to be new to a hobby. Everyone else, thanks for bashing a claimed noobie because that would just help me correct all my problems. I guess I'm sorry I didn't major in Aquarium Keeping in college, because my former LFS had all the "right" answers that is responsible for most of the death I've had, Fishtown USA. Because Aquacon, and reefs2go likes to send you dead fish everytime so you can chase your credit card for the money back. Because when you google "how to start an aquarium" and spend days reading up on it before you actually start on the hobby, you will learn everything you have learned in your full experience of keeping fish. No, I said I started 6 months ago, end of that and if you think I'm just some retard still then go f yourself. I did everything that I mentioned in my post, not being proud of everything, but most have added to my knowledge.

Most of you guys have a problem with me flushing fish. Let me tell you what an experienced reefer told me when I asked what to do with them, "flush it". Fishes do not come with a label that states "do not dispose of in drain". And then you will bash me on common sense, right. To the uneducated the common sense is the toilet ends up in the ocean, saltwater ocean, give the fish a fighting chance.

I know I have stuff that are doomed to die, how do I know? They're already dead. Does anyone tell me they're going to die when I buy it? No... When I google it on my phone prior to buying, does it say it's going to die? Sometimes, but mostly indirectly. Did I put a cover on after the first wrasse jumped? Yes... Did it say anywhere that Emerald crabs are going to kill 3 of my nicer fishes? No... Did I eventually figure it out and get rid of the crabs? Yes... Did I flush them? No, it was no longer my first month in the hobby.

Tank cycling... I am 6 months into the hobby, how is it that my tank is not cycled? I didn't start over when I switched tanks, everything was transfered and added. I have coraline all over my once dry rocks, doesn't it mean my tank is somewhat cycled? I have no ammonia or nitrate problems, I checked this past weekend. Is my tank not cycled? What's going to change in 5 years? You guys say "I will see", yet you bash me for not knowing. I have the 2 API test kits, Saltwater and Reef Master, and the last I checked everything is as recommended in the manual. Why do I have to check more often than that if it's been the same after every month? I dose calcium weekly, so I check calcium weekly, and no, I have not been properly introduced to magnesium yet.

I have a 250gal Coralife skimmer since the beginning, it's not supposed to be crap, but I know it's a crap skimmer because it barely fills up every week. The tube part is always the grimiest, but never in the cup.
As far as nutrient export goes, I have been reading about algae scrubbers, and from what I understand, trimming my macros would do a similar job. And you can only trim when they grow, which requires light.
Hence more light = more algae = less nitrate...?

 

[nanoreefer22]

:lol: Good luck to ya

 

[qqfob]

Kris, here's the piece of Meteor Shower Cyphastrea I got from you a while back.

4-5 months ago

today

 

[nanoreefer22]

That's cool and all but what irked me was the flushing of fish. Didn't say you can't get a coral to color up.

 

[JimmyR1rider]

The only reason I bashed you a bit was because you outright admitted you flushed fish for the purpose of making room. When I was new I asked enough questions before I set anything up that I understood what happens during a nitrogen cycle. Letting that happen is the most important thing you'll do in the beginning of your tank.

You should also be doing more frequent water changes as well as testing more often if only to really familiarize yourself with the kits you use. They expire so you might as well use them while still good or it's a waste of money.

I'm sorry if your feelings got hurt but if I posted what you did in the manner you did I'd fully expect to catch some grief about it.

 

[KathyC]

Again I agree with nanoreerfer, it was your comment regarding the flushing of the chromis that has upset folks here. If someone has unwanted fish around they sell them...not flush them. Was it that urgent to get rid of them?
Common sense dictates that your toilet is not full of SW, it is full of tap water that is loaded with chlorine and floride and all sorts of other nonsense, nor does it drain directly into the ocean. There is no 'fighting chance' for a fish that is flushed, it is a painful dead for them.

I for one, would cross that 'experienced reefer' off my list of who to turn when looking for advice.

Regarding your very first comment on your post - you stated you can cycle a tank in a 'rush week'. Sorry but that is not possible if one is to do it correctly. There are no magic potions in a bottle for this purpose.
Btw - that Special Blend you added is likely why your nitrates are so high...it is a bottle full of nitrites - which are then eaten by the nitrates - which you are encouraging to multiply by providing them with so much 'food'.
You will have far less nutrients to export from your tank if you are not directly adding them to your tank.
Do you still add it to your tank?
A tank with 20 fish in it begs for weekly water changes.

We have a forum here on MR called 'Reefs For Beginners'. At the top of that forum there are multiple 'stickies' that are LOADED with information for beginners. Just about everything you need to know about water quality is in there, and if it is not, then yes, we are an internet forum and you can ask any and all question you may have and get a ton of responses in no time at all.

With the exception of Fishtown (imo due to their proven poor reputation), I cannot imagine that the other LFS's that you mentioned (in your 1st post) would not have given you accurate info/advice on any livestock - fish or coral that you were purchasing...had you asked.
Had you said...I'm new to this..I have this size tank with X amount of fish in it...my tank is x weeks/months old... or even ..what does this fish/coral/invert require to thrive...that none of these places would have advised you that you have too many/incompatible fish/corals/inverts or that what you were looking to purchase were inappropriate for a beginner or your current bio-load.
(I do not include the place on Kissena in this group of LFS's as I am unfamiliar with them)

Regarding lighting you say:

3. LEDs... My light cycle also stays on till midnight to double as a night light, then the sump light takes over.

3a. Yes, longer light cycle will grow unwanted algae, but that unwanted algae also reduces nitrate, so do yourself a favor and start growing that coraline asap.

..and then you say this:

As far as nutrient export goes, I have been reading about algae scrubbers, and from what I understand, trimming my macros would do a similar job. And you can only trim when they grow, which requires light.
Hence more light = more algae = less nitrate...?

There is a huge difference between leaving your DT lights on for too long a period and running a FUGE light over your macros.

One will give you nuisance algae - the other will cause your macros to grow and will help export nutrients (you still need to do weekly water changes...)
How long is the lighting cycle in your DT?

...and yes, the Coral-life skimmer would be considered...let's call it inferior...

We are here 24/7 to answer any & all questions that anyone has regarding reefkeeping...but you need to ask the questions first!

 

[Imbarrie]

So we can treat this as the noob baseline of knowledge.

 

[jetthril]

Imagine you are getting thrown out from a room with warm ambient temperature, into another room with compressed air pressure, 30 degrees cooler, and oh yeah, it's completely dark and small. There is no quick way out! This is what your fish experience when you flush the alive down the drain.

It's bad enough these fish are taken out from a world of water with no walls into a glass box. They depend on us to feed them and care for them. As reef keepers we are responsible for the lives that we take into our aquariums. To dispose them while alive is senseless and just plain cruel.

Why didn't you just give the fish back to the store or give to a reefer friend? Please be more considerate before you purchase another coral or fish.

If your basic morals are that animals are just something we can discard at will, then you probably shouldn't keep any pets.