fish tank room question vapor barrier or not.

[acolaojr]

I am building a fishtank room with my basement gut renovation. Question that I am getting mixed answers on. I have the ceiling exposed right now and was planning on tacking 6 mil plastic on the ceiling joists before the sheetrock as a vapor barrier. I am getting mixed feedback as to do it or not. Some people are telling me not to put the plastic as it will create condensation between the drywall and plastic which will result in mold issues and to just let the floor "breathe". Others are telling me that I will get mold issues if I don't put the vapor barrier. Can someone shed some light to personal experience with this?

 

[michaelm2431]

Let me try to explain this.
Air and vapor will and can seep thru almost anything except plastic.

With plastic on the ceiling, you might get condensation in the room because the air is not escaping anywhere. If you have a dehumidifier in the basement will be great. It will hold a better temperature.

No plastic, the air exchanges with the air upstairs.

 

[michaelm2431]

Most new houses in my area are putting the plastic on all their walls. Heating and air bills are almost cut in half. I've never seen moister behind sheet-rock and on the plastic and I've been building for over 40 years. I remodeled my house last year and put the 6 mill on all my walls and bills went down. I am getting a little moister on my windows because the inside air cant excape.

 

[acolaojr]

Ok so your pro plastic. What if I put a bathroom exhaust vent in the room if I put the plastic on the ceiling think that would help get rid of the extra moisture? I feel like a dehumidifier in the room would just increase tank evaporation. What do you mean when you say air bills? HVAC costs?

 

[michaelm2431]

Yes HVAC will be cheaper because room would be sealed better. Don't know if you'll see a big difference just doing the ceiling.
A good bath exhaust would be great, even better if you can put it on a humidistat.

 

[michaelm2431]

What kind of heat do you have in the basement?

 

[theMeat]

Have been doing contracting for decades. The only places you should put plastic are around shower, and around cement walls in basement. When in shower it goes between cement/tile board and studs. When doing basement it goes between cement outside wall and studs. So no, don't put plastic on ceiling behind sheetrock, or drop ceiling. Have adequate ventilation, otherwise not only will you have the potential to get a build up of moisture, but co2, ph, and low skimmate issues with tank.

If your heating bills get cut in half by wrapping your house in plastic, your house has some major issues, and now mold issues too, lol

 

[michaelm2431]

If your heating bills get cut in half by wrapping your house in plastic, your house has some major issues, and now mold issues too, lol

I still have electric baseboard...lol. Haven't gotten my new HVAC system installed yet. Just bought house last year.
No mold. All high dollar homes in NJ by the water are getting vapor bariers on walls these days.

 

[theMeat]

I still have electric baseboard...lol. Haven't gotten my new HVAC system installed yet. Just bought house last year.
No mold. All high dollar homes in NJ by the water are getting vapor bariers on walls these days.

Wow, that's costing you. Much more comfy and efficient to go with a hot water heat, and ductless ac, instead of hvac

Vapor barrier goes outside, under siding and outside insulation, on top of outside sheeting, or is supposed to. That's not going out of style anytime soon. There is confusion between vapor barrier and an air barrier. A vapor barrier allows a degree or air and moisture through. An air barrier, like plastic, does not. Either way, not a good idea to trap sheetrock in moisture, so no plastic on any inside walls, or inside any outside walls, except the shower.

 

[michaelm2431]

Gonna go with the Mitsubeshi heat and air. It's half the price of everything else. Whole house was elect. No gas. I ran gas and installed a tankless H/W/H and stove and ran extra gas line in attic till we decide which heating and air to go with. Ran out of funds with the complete gut job.

 

[acolaojr]

hah I'm in the same exact boat. Bought house last year 100% electric installed pellet stove fire place insert to help with heating cost. No AC until this summer when the first warm day hit my wife was screaming at me ended up installing HVAC with electric heat pump which was really intended with Florida homes not NY but thought the unit would circulate my pellet stove heat. Met with ductless guy today who was pushing propane boiler while I have everything open but like you said "funds" hurt with new boilers. Anyway back to the vapor barrier not sure what the right choice is wish someone with personal experience can chime in.

 

[theMeat]

Thought i explained it pretty well. You can lead a horse to water but.....

I'll try again....

http://www.energyvanguard.com/blog-...-You-Put-a-Plastic-Vapor-Barrier-in-Your-Wall

Not a good idea to trap moisture in, especially with drywall, green board or not, mold will develop. Vent the room if you can. If not get a dehumidifier that drains into a drain pipe, so it doesn't shut off when the bucket fills.

 

[acolaojr]

Yea I understand your point you think I should let it breathe. That's were I was heading but wanted to know if someone did use the plastic as I understand it is a way to sound proof a room as well as control evaporation. I am 90 % sure I will be leaving the ceiling alone and just adding a bathroom vent to help with moisture. Article is a good read. Thank you

 

[clasystems]

I think the moral of the story is never to trap moisture, you will get mold and other bad things over time. If you feel the need to stop air from moving between walls you probably have a reason for it ie: ERV coverage in those rooms or unconditioned space adjoining conditioned space, etc. If you run an advanced HVAC system that monitors humidity and temp in every room you can easily wrapup all the walls in plastic and have no issues.

 

[theMeat]

Acoustic soundboard is best for sound proofing, but not cheap. lotsa studios and whatnot use the much cheaper option of doubling up 5/8 sheetrock. Amazing how much that does. Want more, put insulation in the stud cavity.

Spend a coupla extra bucks and get an exhaust fan with atleast 6" outlet, and adjustable humidity sensor control. Like this....
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Delta-Br...ty-Sensor-and-Speed-Control-SIG110H/204347754

 

[Johnny Spesis]

My 180 is in the basement, and with proper ventilation, there shouldn't be any problems. My basement is finished. Heat is never on. Temp is about 65 degrees now and 75 or less during the summer. My tank temp is stable at 77 degrees. I don't run a chiller. In the summer, I open my basement windows for ventilation. Ventilation or at least, air circulation is key. If your basement is musty, clean, fix, seal, and paint. You need to create a dry eniviroment first, air circulation will stop mold from growing, but a clean area is needed first. Same as your bathroom that you use to shower everyday. Have you seen some bathrooms, I have a friend who called me very sick and needed a doctor. When I got to the house I used the bathroom, and notice the window was never opened. There's no exhaust fan, and I could smell the mold, and found it. He never smelled anything! Black Mold will kill you, ask a boat owner!!!

 

[acolaojr]

Ok just to let everyone know what I'm thinking would like some advice. The room is in the basement going to paint mold resistant paint on the ceiling joists and exposed sheathing. Use metal stud for all walls. Put 2x6 foil faced insulation between the 2x10 joists leaving a couple of inches for air movement. I will have two vents that have humidity monitors on them. Purple board on all walls and foil faced insulation on the partition wall. I cant decide to either bring down a return and supply from my attic blower which will eat up all of my attic space. Or use a ductless unit in the room which will only recirculate the air in the room in which case I will have to bring exterior air to the tank some how. Thinking of bringing a PVC line from the outside to the tank for oxygen.

 

[clasystems]

How about an ERV? You can get a decent one for $500 and you wont loose as much heat as venting. Not sure where you are but during the winter in NY things gonna get cold fast if youre moving air into the space.

 

[acolaojr]

There is a ductless unit that acts as a dehumidifier and uses exterior air when operating. I am leaning towards that option. I think it acts like an ERV. From what I've read ERV systems are more geared toward warmer weather climates.