Slamming Experts and Hobbyist
- Thread starter Boss_512
- Start date
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I've been thinking of doing the same, but thought the cost of power alone would make it not worth the expense.
It depends on your profit margin and volume though.
As well as what you keep.
Do you make good money with this?
I've been thinking of doing the same, but thought the cost of power alone would make it not worth the expense.
It depends on your profit margin and volume though.
As well as what you keep.
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote
Pretty spineless huh ernie?
I purposefully ingnored this post as a sort of way of boycotting this type thread. But I couln't resist this one!
[ April 06, 2002: Message edited by: Louey ]</p>
Pretty spineless huh ernie?
I purposefully ingnored this post as a sort of way of boycotting this type thread. But I couln't resist this one!
[ April 06, 2002: Message edited by: Louey ]</p>
I must say that I mostly agree with Tazz and Kim.
I am an intelligent person. I am also new to the hobby. I read several books, patrolled every site I could find, and talked to everyone involved in the hobby that I could find before buying my system. Here are some of the conclusions I have come to:
* There are a few basics that the vast majority of people agree with. Protein skimming. Large systems are more forgiving. Plan and take your time. Research. Learn. Ask questions. Live rock is good. Not all fish get along. Etc..
* There are some things that are not universally agreed on but that I have been taught by people I have come to respect. Quarantine tanks are a necessity. Freshwater dips should be 5 minutes. Use a live substrate. Etc...
* There are MANY things that have no universal agreement. What is the proper bioload for a tank? What is the proper amount of lighting for a coral tank? Does wet/dry filtering have a place?
* I strongly agree with Kim when she says that posting on this board is intimidating. I have kept to lurking in order to learn, but am very hesitant to post about my experiences, thus far. What would you guys say if I announced that I have a wet/dry filter? Would I be branded as an ignorant newb? Or what if you knew that I have a lawnmower blenny? (doing fine, btw, ate all of my hair algae and seems to be eating the nori quite well) Would you call me ignorant and cruel, dooming the poor guy to a slow death?
I think that new posters open themselves up for flaming when they post something contrary to something in the first category that I mentioned, i.e. doing something that shows that they did not even basic research.
However, and I think this is what Tazz was refering to, I think some of the regulars will flame folks for trying something that falls in the category 'not universally accepted' but goes against whatever the regular has experienced or believes. Tazz was saying that even he has had different results with different systems in his house, and that there are many, many things that simply cannot be universally true, but rather vary from system to system and individual to individual.
I agree with this. I mean, we are not talking about mathematics or astronomy. We are all building miniature ecosystems composed of living organisms. I haven't even seen a good definition of 'success' in this hobby. Should success be defined by how long your animals live compared to the wild? How much fun you have? Community outreach/education? Reef conservation? Somebody answer this so then I can determine if I am having success.
Finally, I think you have all pretty much proven Tazz's point. He stated, in my opinion, a valid and well-thought out opinion. And has been unmercifully hounded for it. You have attacked him personally, called him a troll, questioned his honesty, etc... NOT ONE regular repsonded with a reply along the lines of 'Sorry you feel that way, Tazz, we try to be objective and help those new to the hobby, but it's possible we may deserve a little criticism, we'll try to do better, please join us."
Not that any of this really matters to me. I will continue to lurk and try to learn as much as I can when I can. If I ever get to the point where I feel I can help others, I will do that, too.
You guys keep on ripping up folks for whatever you like. Or try and learn and be more accomodating. Either way, this community will be what you regulars make it.
fracguru
I am an intelligent person. I am also new to the hobby. I read several books, patrolled every site I could find, and talked to everyone involved in the hobby that I could find before buying my system. Here are some of the conclusions I have come to:
* There are a few basics that the vast majority of people agree with. Protein skimming. Large systems are more forgiving. Plan and take your time. Research. Learn. Ask questions. Live rock is good. Not all fish get along. Etc..
* There are some things that are not universally agreed on but that I have been taught by people I have come to respect. Quarantine tanks are a necessity. Freshwater dips should be 5 minutes. Use a live substrate. Etc...
* There are MANY things that have no universal agreement. What is the proper bioload for a tank? What is the proper amount of lighting for a coral tank? Does wet/dry filtering have a place?
* I strongly agree with Kim when she says that posting on this board is intimidating. I have kept to lurking in order to learn, but am very hesitant to post about my experiences, thus far. What would you guys say if I announced that I have a wet/dry filter? Would I be branded as an ignorant newb? Or what if you knew that I have a lawnmower blenny? (doing fine, btw, ate all of my hair algae and seems to be eating the nori quite well) Would you call me ignorant and cruel, dooming the poor guy to a slow death?
I think that new posters open themselves up for flaming when they post something contrary to something in the first category that I mentioned, i.e. doing something that shows that they did not even basic research.
However, and I think this is what Tazz was refering to, I think some of the regulars will flame folks for trying something that falls in the category 'not universally accepted' but goes against whatever the regular has experienced or believes. Tazz was saying that even he has had different results with different systems in his house, and that there are many, many things that simply cannot be universally true, but rather vary from system to system and individual to individual.
I agree with this. I mean, we are not talking about mathematics or astronomy. We are all building miniature ecosystems composed of living organisms. I haven't even seen a good definition of 'success' in this hobby. Should success be defined by how long your animals live compared to the wild? How much fun you have? Community outreach/education? Reef conservation? Somebody answer this so then I can determine if I am having success.
Finally, I think you have all pretty much proven Tazz's point. He stated, in my opinion, a valid and well-thought out opinion. And has been unmercifully hounded for it. You have attacked him personally, called him a troll, questioned his honesty, etc... NOT ONE regular repsonded with a reply along the lines of 'Sorry you feel that way, Tazz, we try to be objective and help those new to the hobby, but it's possible we may deserve a little criticism, we'll try to do better, please join us."
Not that any of this really matters to me. I will continue to lurk and try to learn as much as I can when I can. If I ever get to the point where I feel I can help others, I will do that, too.
You guys keep on ripping up folks for whatever you like. Or try and learn and be more accomodating. Either way, this community will be what you regulars make it.
fracguru
fracguru,
Point taken, and well stated.
A lot of the same opinions that are expressed here are the results of years of varying experiences, and of course some may be wrong.
I do think though, that almost all of the common ones can and should be challanged, if the appropriate info to back up the new claim is provided. Answering further questions regarding ALL of the possible contributing factors is something that I think regular posters here do quite well.
If someone is only going to give us all a good finger wagging, and then not back up their position, what did you really expect for a rebuttal? That's what Tazz seemed to do.
I don't think that any of us are unwilling to find out what may be behind an exception to any of our reefkeeping "rules" .
Mitch
Point taken, and well stated.
A lot of the same opinions that are expressed here are the results of years of varying experiences, and of course some may be wrong.
I do think though, that almost all of the common ones can and should be challanged, if the appropriate info to back up the new claim is provided. Answering further questions regarding ALL of the possible contributing factors is something that I think regular posters here do quite well.
If someone is only going to give us all a good finger wagging, and then not back up their position, what did you really expect for a rebuttal? That's what Tazz seemed to do.
I don't think that any of us are unwilling to find out what may be behind an exception to any of our reefkeeping "rules" .
Mitch
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote
A rare species, often onery, ill-tempered and difficult at best to keep happy.
Actually it is danmhippo, who is a member here on reefs.org who at times takes some good-natured abuse. The funny thing is that his real name (I believe) is not Dan but Jimmy.
Ernie
A rare species, often onery, ill-tempered and difficult at best to keep happy.
Actually it is danmhippo, who is a member here on reefs.org who at times takes some good-natured abuse. The funny thing is that his real name (I believe) is not Dan but Jimmy.
Ernie
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