WWW.SEAHORSE.ORG mods quiting?

[Ben1]

Whats happening over there. All the mods are qiuting and moving to a new site. They seem to say seahorse.org has changed and thats why they have to move, wierd you would think the mods would help change the board to make it better not just up and leave

 

[old ron]

I would guess the crew has tried, there are some very headstrong people
I hope both sites do very well as seahorses are becoming popular and there is a lot to learn about them and their needs. I for one will use both sites and be supportive of both.

 

[Lady Godiva]

I can't get a straight answer out of either site. Everyone is being a politician.
Regardless of what went on to cause the split, I've lost any respect I had for the folks at the new site, especially Chris Burns. According to Seahorse.org the moderators copied all the files from Seahorse.org and are now displaying all the posts and forums, verbatum on the new site. The administrator of Seahorse.org posted correspondence between herself and the moderators just days before this happen. She was requesting input on some site changes. The feed back she got was up beat and positive.

They appear to be a bunch of back-stabbing bottom dwellers. Just the group one would seek advise from :roll:

 

[jamesw]

Hi Gang,

Seahorse.org is a great site and we try to support them in any way that we can. When people ask seahorse questions, we generally direct them to seahorse.org and when people have freshwater questions, we direct them to e-aquaria.com

When people have questions about how to prepare their taxes, we send them to the sump...

Cheers
James

 

[Sydney Seahorse]

Hi guys, sorry that you don't seem to have the full story there, if you visit the new site you will find your answers there. Don't you think it a little odd that every single moderator has left the site? Does that not point to a problem with the one remaining administrator? I guess you are free to believe that one person over the dozen or so who left. What's that funny saying you Americans have... "You do the math"!

The reason seahorse.org was a great site was due to the fantastic moderators who put heart & soul into the site, posting daily and working their butts off. These same people can be found at the new site. I challenge you to find a more knowledgeable, hard working, dedicated bunch of people.

Most of the articles, photos and information lent to the site belonged to these people, and they have every right to remove it to another site. Nothing was produced excusively for seahorse.org, or even for seahorse.org at all, it was lent to the site at the owners' discretion. You will find many similarities between the two sites initially, mainly because they were created by the same person! However, syngnathid.org will grow & evolve, like all new sites, and all are welcome to pop in for a vist, join or just browse around.

As for feedback re changes to the site, feedback was "upbeat & positive"? Ther was ONE brief reply. One. No one was stabbed anywhere. Settle down.

 

[Lady Godiva]

http://www.seahorse.org/cgi-bin/UBB/ult ... 1&t=000019

There were 4 replies to the request for input, FOUR. All the replies were from the people who were about to dump the site just days later. What's up with that?

What's going on SS? We are left to conjecturing. Let's face it, you guys aren't looking so good. Dump the site with no warning to the admin, copy the entire database and website and call it your own..... Can't you give us the scope?

 

[Sydney Seahorse]

LG, what you were inferring was that a bunch of moderators replied to that thread with "up beat" replies, then "stabbed" Karen in the back. ONE moderator left a short reply. The other three are current members of the old site, as you can see.

As stated in my previous post, all the information is available to you at www.syngnathid.org. You should also have been emailed personally if you were a member of seahorse.org prior to April 2002, and your email addy on that site was current.

HTH

 

[Simona]

Perhaps if you put your heart and soul into a site, you'd feel alot differently.

These people worked HARD for the members. I find it a bit strange that there's now only one moderator left, don't you? Mmm, I wonder why?

 

[liquid]

FWIW, in reviewing everything on both websites it really says something that every single moderator left for syngnathid.org with the exception of the curator. I don't know what's up w/ that, but it sure peaks my interest. :?:

Shane

 

[Anonymous]

hmmm....

out of curiosity, i checked out both sites...

irrespective of the reasons behind the 'split'-the method(s) used by those who left indicate(to me) slightly immature behavior-by using the 'old site as the means to advertise the new one.

if i was a mod here-and used the same m.o. when starting a new bb-i'm sure folks would see my behavior as rather childish-irrespective of the circumstances. :wink:

looks to me like airing private dirty laundry in public, and using it as a tool to publicize a 'new' site-which also seems to be a direct copy of the 'old'.

just my $.03 :wink:

 

[Minh Nguyen]

http://www.seahorse.org/cgi-bin/UBB/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=21&t=000019

There were 4 replies to the request for input, FOUR. All the replies were from the people who were about to dump the site just days later. What's up with that?

What's going on SS? We are left to conjecturing. Let's face it, you guys aren't looking so good. Dump the site with no warning to the admin, copy the entire database and website and call it your own..... Can't you give us the scope?

I completely agree. Leaving is one thing. Leaving and copy the entire site and establish a mirror site is backstabbing. I don't know and don't really care what went on between the two sides.
One can wonder about the motive for leaving. Sounds like money to me. Karen developed and owned the site from the beginning. She supports it when it was new. Now it is busy, have sponsors… You get my point.
Minh Nguyen

 

[SPC]

Sea Sydney,
Just curious, was Reef Engineer (Randy) banned or something from Seahorse.org?
Steve

 

[Anonymous]

I cant really find a reason why they all left other than 'they don't like there no more'. I find the new site to be substantially similar to the old one. I think the resignation letters were published with malice. The explanation on the new site is woefully lacking, and doesn't line up with info about these events on the old site - Karen's explanation of the alleged 'lock out' makes complete and total sense. I find the unsubstantiated claims that Karen hacked the new site to be distasteful, defamatory and sleazy. It seems the people that publicly resigned from the public form that is seahorse.org fail to understand copyright issues and want to hold seahorse.org to legal standards they don't feel the need to live up to.

What I find most distressing is that is seems the apparent coup was organized during a time when Karen was led to believe everything was good, and estranged mods were coming back into the fold. In short, she was being told everything was fine while they were duping all the material on seahorse.org (including form posts - clearly the prosperity of seahorse.org - and member registration information including passwords and log on id's).

It is fine to start an new site because you don't like the old one. However, I do not think it is fine to do what these people have done, nor do I think the way they did it deserves any respect.

RR

I do not keep seahorses, nor do I know any of the people involved in this issue. I just find this type of behavior interesting and instructive on how to live my life.

 

[Sydney Seahorse]

Hahaha I find amusing stuff wherever I go these days! It's hilarious how you people have NO IDEA what went on at seahorse.org, yet feel compelled to pass judgement on it! You guys crack me up.

Now, again, if you are truly interested in the truth, let me clear it up for y'all once & for all. If you want names, here they are.

Karen owns the site, pays the $20ish dollars a month or so to keep it up. Whoopee. The sponsors help pay for that. Another whoopee.

Chris built the site. The moderators, every single one, worked their buts off every day. Karen was MIA for over a year. We had a vision of where we were, what we stood for, where we were headed.

Karen came back, changed codes, moved stuff around, locked Chris out of the site (sorry, don't buy her explaination), intercepted personal emails between moderators who were using their seahorse.org email addresses and generally took the heart out of working at the site. A coup was organised.

Now, if you are going to pull off a successful coup, do you tell the person so they can lock you out of retreiving your code, your photos, articles etc, so they can't give their members a resignation letter and forwarding address? I think not. What, you think just up & leaving would have been the way to go? Again, I think not. Members deserved to know who was leaving and why. A single post would have been deleted in seconds, leaving members in the lurch. Enough posts and there was a good chance some would be left for members to view. Vitz, you telling me if you decided to set up a new shop, you wouldn't leave a message here? Come on. I've seen dozens of "Look at our new site" posts on dozens of BBs - how else do you find new places?

The new site looks familiar? Sure does, seeing as it as built by the same person who built the first one. Sponsors coming over to the new site? Well, doesn't that say something for their respect for Chris and the other moderators? FWIW Chris doesn't own the new site, and no one gains financially from sponsorship. Not sure how it works here at reefs.org, but at our org, the sponsors help pay for the site. No moderators are paid to do their job, we do it for the love. So Minh, the lure of the almighty dollar is pretty flimsy!

As for "unsubstantiated" rumours re Karen, again you are welcome to visit the new site and make your own minds up. I think Shane said it best - every single moderator/administrator has left the site, except for Karen. Now, here's that funny and uniquely American saying again "You do the math"!!

PS: SPC, you'll have to ask Randy that. He is at the new site.[/i]

 

[liquid]

Not sure how it works here at reefs.org, but at our org, the sponsors help pay for the site. No moderators are paid to do their job, we do it for the love.

Reefs.org is a non-profit entity. None of the administrators/operators/moderators receive a paycheck for the time that we put in on this website. Our sponsors help pay for the website, server upgrades, software, etc. We do it simply because we love the hobby and want to help educate the current and upcoming marine hobbyists.

If anyone should draw a paycheck from this website, I would say that it probably should be Microchip considering the sheer amount of time he puts in on maintaining the servers, updating the software, and taking care of any problems that arise. However, he doesn't and none of the other ops do.

hth

Shane

 

[Anonymous]

Sydney Seahorse

but wouldn't just one announcement have sufficed?

again-i don't know, or really care, what went on, one way or the other.

just seemed like a public display of sour grapes-which, imo, is always unnecessary :wink: (regardless of the rationalizations from either side :wink: )

 

[Anonymous]

! It's hilarious how you people have NO IDEA what went on at seahorse.org, yet feel compelled to pass judgement on it! You guys crack me up.

Actually I spent at least an hour reading up this issue on both sites. If you have actual facts that you wish to share that aren't on the two sites, I would love to take a look at them.

Now, again, if you are truly interested in the truth, let me clear it up for y'all once & for all. If you want names, here they are.

What, somehow your perspective on the issues is fair and unbiased?

Karen owns the site, pays the $20ish dollars a month or so to keep it up. Whoopee. The sponsors help pay for that. Another whoopee.

Well, Karen owning the site is more than a dismissive 'whoopiee'. Perhaps she did a bad job (I have no idea), but she does own it and that entitles her to do as she pleases.

Chris built the site. The moderators, every single one, worked their buts off every day. Karen was MIA for over a year. We had a vision of where we were, what we stood for, where we were headed.

Thats great, but you guys did not own the site. I think the lesson here is if you are going to put major time and effort into a project, make sure you know who owns it and get an agreement in writing before you do any work.

Karen came back, changed codes, moved stuff around, locked Chris out of the site (sorry, don't buy her explaination), intercepted personal emails between moderators who were using their seahorse.org email addresses and generally took the heart out of working at the site. A coup was organised.

So because you did not like the way the owner of the site was working (and of course you don't buy her explanations for anything) you feel free to take what you want and try to screw her over. Sounds icky to me.

Now, if you are going to pull off a successful coup, do you tell the person so they can lock you out of retreiving your code, your photos, articles etc, so they can't give their members a resignation letter and forwarding address? I think not.

Well, the whole coup idea is a littly icky to begin with.
Do you not have copies of your code, your photos, articles etc? Do you really need to take them all from the site? Weird. I have most everything I publish to the web backed up so if I need it, I can get it.
Also, since you agree that Karen owns the site, the things on the site aren't really yours are they?
And if you are quitting, why do you think you have the right to give the members any notice or a forwarding address. Those things are curtesies that Karen appears to be giving you dispite your worry. All the resignation letters are still up on her site. The actions show that she is not trying to squash anything, and you are.

What, you think just up & leaving would have been the way to go? Again, I think not. Members deserved to know who was leaving and why.

Yes. Just going would have been the thing to do. If the members deserved to know (and since Karen owns the site this might be up to her) word still would have gotten to them. Starting a thread about it might have been enough.

A single post would have been deleted in seconds, leaving members in the lurch.

But now we will never know if it would have been deleted or not. We only have your word on this and since you were planing a coup your word is suspect.

Enough posts and there was a good chance some would be left for members to view.

But it seems that they are ALL left there.

Vitz, you telling me if you decided to set up a new shop, you wouldn't leave a message here? Come on. I've seen dozens of "Look at our new site" posts on dozens of BBs - how else do you find new places?

Messages are fine. Trying to destroy the site while busily copying eveything from that site so you can use it seems to be in a different league from leaving 'new site' messages.

As for "unsubstantiated" rumours re Karen, again you are welcome to visit the new site and make your own minds up.

I have, but you don't think that is good enough. Show me some proof that Karen hacked your new site and I will gladly change my tune.

I think Shane said it best - every single moderator/administrator has left the site, except for Karen. Now, here's that funny and uniquely American saying again "You do the math"!!

I agree the math looks odd. However, the way you guys left leaves much to be desired.
I have been through a couple of business breakups. The best way I have found to deal with it is not to try to make the other party look bad, eventhough it feels so good to do it. If you keep your nose squeaky clean and let your work be better than theirs, everyone will come to you. But trying to werck their reputation only makes you look bad too.

I don't know what actually happened, and at this point I think we will never know. I do know if I am in need of seahorse information I will look at both sites.

 

[Sydney Seahorse]

:lol: still laughing, cause it's done, over, kaput, we did as we pleased the way we wanted to do it, and whatever you may or may not say, it was our choice. If ya don't like it, lump it! Sour grapes, spam, whatever you want to call it, it's what we wanted to do. When you pull a coup, you can do it whatever way you like

As for icky, hehe good word, I don't feel compelled to go into more details about the personal stuff that went on "behind the scenes", as I don't really feel it's my place. I wasn't personally involved in those areas, so I may not be able to present you will all the facts. It was sufficient to me that trusted friends felt strongly enough to make this move, and when they asked me to come along, I stuck by them. I believe you can ask the administrators to email you those details, if you are interested in delving further.

Righty, you seem to be able to grasp that "the math looks odd", why not explore that angle a little more thoroughly. You'll find all your answers there. See above.

PS: Shane, not casting any doubt over this board, I just wasn't sure how things were done here. Seems pretty much the same sort of deal as ours, then.

 

[Anonymous]

Sydney Seahorse wrote:

still laughing, cause it's done, over, kaput, we did as we pleased the way we wanted to do it, and whatever you may or may not say, it was our choice. If ya don't like it, lump it! Sour grapes, spam, whatever you want to call it, it's what we wanted to do. When you pull a coup, you can do it whatever way you like

:roll: leaving over differences/disagreements is one thing, a 'coup' is quite something else :wink:

just a further illustration of extremely infantile mentality

As for icky, hehe good word, I don't feel compelled to go into more details about the personal stuff that went on "behind the scenes", as I don't really feel it's my place. I wasn't personally involved in those areas, so I may not be able to present you will all the facts. It was sufficient to me that trusted friends felt strongly enough to make this move, and when they asked me to come along, I stuck by them. I believe you can ask the administrators to email you those details, if you are interested in delving further

so you just joined a 'coup' w/out even checking the facts? what a good little nazi... :roll:


fwiw-i'm not that great w/math-but i'm also smart enough to know that numbers alone are never an indication of who is 'more right'.

kinda like a bunch of people telling you the white line you're looking at is actually black :wink:

 

[SPC]

still laughing, cause it's done, over, kaput, we did as we pleased the way we wanted to do it, and whatever you may or may not say, it was our choice. If ya don't like it, lump it! Sour grapes, spam, whatever you want to call it, it's what we wanted to do. When you pull a coup, you can do it whatever way you like

-LOL, how do you like them apples Righty :lol: ?
Steve