Kent Garlic Extreme
- Thread starter MoMoney
- Start date
Hey Money:
If you go to kent marine's web site, click on the salt water icon then click on treatments, it will take you the page that has the garlic extreme it has a list of the active ingredients.
HTH
www.kentmarine.com
If you go to kent marine's web site, click on the salt water icon then click on treatments, it will take you the page that has the garlic extreme it has a list of the active ingredients.
HTH
www.kentmarine.com
FWIW, the "active" ingredient in garlic extracts is allycin. A form of naturally occuring anti-biotic, anti-antigonist. It tends to boost a fish's natural immunity to secondary infections caused by parasitic infestation.
Many differ on whether it should be used profilactically, or as a targeted treatment of symptoms. As with any antibiotic, the target organism can adapt by mutation and form a resistance. Use with care.
Many differ on whether it should be used profilactically, or as a targeted treatment of symptoms. As with any antibiotic, the target organism can adapt by mutation and form a resistance. Use with care.
Hi guys:
FWIW, the Kyolic brand of garlic is cheaper, doesn't smell as bad, and you get more product for the money. This is our brand of choice, and you can pick it up at most health food places. Here in the No. VA area, it's found at the Vitamin Shoppe stores, $11.99 for a 2 oz. bottle. We field tested this brand, against other types of garlic remedies, for 12 mos., and the Kyolic was our favorite. Somebody started a garlic thread at Reef Central, and someone replied that due to the nature of a fish's digestive system and liver function, allicin cannot possibly be the active ingredient that inhibits ich. If that's true, then what is it about garlic that works? HTH - Staff
P.S. What's up snappster?!
FWIW, the Kyolic brand of garlic is cheaper, doesn't smell as bad, and you get more product for the money. This is our brand of choice, and you can pick it up at most health food places. Here in the No. VA area, it's found at the Vitamin Shoppe stores, $11.99 for a 2 oz. bottle. We field tested this brand, against other types of garlic remedies, for 12 mos., and the Kyolic was our favorite. Somebody started a garlic thread at Reef Central, and someone replied that due to the nature of a fish's digestive system and liver function, allicin cannot possibly be the active ingredient that inhibits ich. If that's true, then what is it about garlic that works? HTH - Staff
P.S. What's up snappster?!
I've been using Kyolic now for almost 3 weeks. My powder Blue is still showing signs of having parasites and it's only getting worse. I feed at least twice a day and the PB eats like it's his last meal every time. I usually let food absorb kyolic for about 15 minutes. Is this not long enough?
I use the Garlic Xtreme as a food soak also. I soak my food overnight in Zoe, Zoecon, phyto and chromaplex. VitC . My fish couldnt be healthier.....
I have had tangs with the worst case of Ich and after dosing the VitC and Garlic. They recover beautifully....
hth
i do dose sparingly.... dont want ot build an immunity....
I have had tangs with the worst case of Ich and after dosing the VitC and Garlic. They recover beautifully....
hth
i do dose sparingly.... dont want ot build an immunity....
reeftanklfs":3n34tg3z said:
fwiw:
it's probably what get's absorbed into the fish's tissue before the garlic hits the g.i. tract that does enable some of the allicyn to get into the fish, via the tissues in the mouth and throat.
check out this thread, and the link to the article on garlic in the thread
http://reefs.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=203259
hth
Hi guys:
First, Momoney, to answer your question, soaking the food in garlic for 15 min. is more than enough. We usually just soak it for 5-10 min. Any garlic remedy is just a treatment, not a cure. Almost 100% of the time when we have a customer who is using garlic, and still has an ich infestation, we find that one or more of the water parameters is off. Sometimes the cause could also be fish incompatability (the affected fish is being harassed by one of its tank mates). We ask the big four questions, what is your salinity, ph, alkalinity, and temperature. It's almost 9 out of 10 times it's one of these. You wouldn't believe how many times it's the salinity that is off substantially; thus, we ask the customer to bring in his hydrometer so we can test it against our refractometer. See if it's one of your parameters. I just noticed that you said that you have a powder blue tang. These guys are a pain because no matter how pristine your water conditions are, they'll still break out with ich. I don't mean to say that this happens 100% of the time, but it happens enough that we tell our customers that they should expect these things to break out with ich; keep feeding it (with garlic), and watch your water parameters. The members of this particular genus, Acanthurus, are particularly high strung animals, and they also require quite a bit of water current. Blast them!
We were the only store to have done any sort of field study with garlic. This was not strictly scientific (i.e. controls, control groups etc...) but we did record findings, dosages, etc... We studied several types of garlic, Kyolic, cloves, garlic juice (Mckormic brand), garlic oil (Healthway brand), garlic powder (Mckormic brand). Long and short of it, the cloves had the best results, but a lot of people do not like the amount of time to prepare, nor the smell associated. A close second was the Kyolic (2 oz. liquid, bottled), hardly any smell, and water based. The results with the Kyolic almost mirrored the cloves. Garlic powder and oil sucked, and the garlic juice was only marginally better than the aforementioned two. We ran the study for 12 mos. We didn't lose a single invert to any of the garlic remedies. We posted some of our findings here and on reefcentral a couple of years ago. Remember this is only a treatment, and is most effective when correcting the cause of the ich. The best "cure" for ich is copper (it will kill it). Our recommended dosage for garlic is 2-3 drops of garlic for every piece of food (frozen cube, pinch of flake, etc...). Using the cloves, use 1 crushed clove for the total amount of food, marinate for 10 min., and then take clove out, feed fish. Use the water out of your tank to marinade the food. You can feed garlic to your fish everyday, and even mix supplemental vitamins like LA-Lawman does, and it won't harm any invert. HTH.
Vitz:
Thanks for the link. In the thread at reefcentral that I was referring to, the guy that said that garlic wouldn't work sounded so worked up against any garlic remedy just because no one had conducted a scientific study, and pompously stated that until someone did, he wouldn't put any garlic anywhere near his fish food. Plus, he quoted some article, which he didn't identify the source of, that said that garlic couldn't work because of a fish's acidic stomach. All we know is that we have had more success with Kyolic garlic than any chemical (except copper), including those so called "invert safe" chemicals. HTH - Staff
First, Momoney, to answer your question, soaking the food in garlic for 15 min. is more than enough. We usually just soak it for 5-10 min. Any garlic remedy is just a treatment, not a cure. Almost 100% of the time when we have a customer who is using garlic, and still has an ich infestation, we find that one or more of the water parameters is off. Sometimes the cause could also be fish incompatability (the affected fish is being harassed by one of its tank mates). We ask the big four questions, what is your salinity, ph, alkalinity, and temperature. It's almost 9 out of 10 times it's one of these. You wouldn't believe how many times it's the salinity that is off substantially; thus, we ask the customer to bring in his hydrometer so we can test it against our refractometer. See if it's one of your parameters. I just noticed that you said that you have a powder blue tang. These guys are a pain because no matter how pristine your water conditions are, they'll still break out with ich. I don't mean to say that this happens 100% of the time, but it happens enough that we tell our customers that they should expect these things to break out with ich; keep feeding it (with garlic), and watch your water parameters. The members of this particular genus, Acanthurus, are particularly high strung animals, and they also require quite a bit of water current. Blast them!
We were the only store to have done any sort of field study with garlic. This was not strictly scientific (i.e. controls, control groups etc...) but we did record findings, dosages, etc... We studied several types of garlic, Kyolic, cloves, garlic juice (Mckormic brand), garlic oil (Healthway brand), garlic powder (Mckormic brand). Long and short of it, the cloves had the best results, but a lot of people do not like the amount of time to prepare, nor the smell associated. A close second was the Kyolic (2 oz. liquid, bottled), hardly any smell, and water based. The results with the Kyolic almost mirrored the cloves. Garlic powder and oil sucked, and the garlic juice was only marginally better than the aforementioned two. We ran the study for 12 mos. We didn't lose a single invert to any of the garlic remedies. We posted some of our findings here and on reefcentral a couple of years ago. Remember this is only a treatment, and is most effective when correcting the cause of the ich. The best "cure" for ich is copper (it will kill it). Our recommended dosage for garlic is 2-3 drops of garlic for every piece of food (frozen cube, pinch of flake, etc...). Using the cloves, use 1 crushed clove for the total amount of food, marinate for 10 min., and then take clove out, feed fish. Use the water out of your tank to marinade the food. You can feed garlic to your fish everyday, and even mix supplemental vitamins like LA-Lawman does, and it won't harm any invert. HTH.
Vitz:
Thanks for the link. In the thread at reefcentral that I was referring to, the guy that said that garlic wouldn't work sounded so worked up against any garlic remedy just because no one had conducted a scientific study, and pompously stated that until someone did, he wouldn't put any garlic anywhere near his fish food. Plus, he quoted some article, which he didn't identify the source of, that said that garlic couldn't work because of a fish's acidic stomach. All we know is that we have had more success with Kyolic garlic than any chemical (except copper), including those so called "invert safe" chemicals. HTH - Staff
I am also a firm believer in a varied diet for your fish. I feed 3 types of frozen food. All the Hikari Brand... Mysis, Brine and Mega Marine....
I soak these in the cocktail mentioned above overnight. then dilute it with aquarium water....
I also use a little romain lettuce with some garlic for the tang. he goes nut for it. I also thnk the garlic is a food atractant. (at least it says it on the bottle.) as soon as the a drop of the stuff comes near the water. my fish ar in position for feeding....
hth
I soak these in the cocktail mentioned above overnight. then dilute it with aquarium water....
I also use a little romain lettuce with some garlic for the tang. he goes nut for it. I also thnk the garlic is a food atractant. (at least it says it on the bottle.) as soon as the a drop of the stuff comes near the water. my fish ar in position for feeding....
hth
Reeftanks
Thanks for your comparative study.
Many people have success with garlic extract if there is a mild infection.
I agree that Kayolic is the best.
McCormicks garlic juice it diluted.
If reefers understand that the idea is to get as much garlic in the fish as possible and to continue for the life cycle of the fish IMO more would have success. IME dry food is better because it absorbs more and of course you have to feed the nori or other dry food soaked food very often.
Thanks for your comparative study.
Many people have success with garlic extract if there is a mild infection.
I agree that Kayolic is the best.
McCormicks garlic juice it diluted.
If reefers understand that the idea is to get as much garlic in the fish as possible and to continue for the life cycle of the fish IMO more would have success. IME dry food is better because it absorbs more and of course you have to feed the nori or other dry food soaked food very often.
Thanks, people, for all the info! Big help! I'll just continue what I'm doing since it seems to coincide with what you're telling me. My PB is looking better BTW. I've also rechecked all parameters and they appear to be fine. I'm thinking that there was a little "interaction" between the PB and my Sailfin that may have set off the ich problem so I've removed the PB for a while. We'll see what happens in a few weeks.
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