Use of ball valves in drain line

[Fishbreath]

I've been searching this forum for quite some time regarding ideas to quiet drain noise. I found zillions of helpful ideas here but I am curious how many reefers are successfully using a ball valve in the drain line without having a flood. Many posters warn not to do this but it seems to me this is safe if both of the following features are in the design-
1. Built-in overflow with slits to keep out big things
2. Use of the prefilter to keep out the rest
Any advice or experience on this? I really want to do this because when my drain pipe is full of water it is totally silent.
Thanks,
Steve

 

[esmithiii]

Use a durso standpipe. Check this out:

http://www.rl180reef.com/pages/standpip ... _frame.htm
http://www.rl180reef.com/pages/standpip ... ndpipe.htm

This is the one I use in my AGA 180g RR:

http://www.rl180reef.com/pages/standpip ... ockman.htm

It is a little more compact than mine.

Either will eliminiate 99% of all noise in your overflow.


Using ball valves to regulate flow are a no-no. I have ball valves to facilitate maintenance, but I leave them open normally.


Ernie

 

[t gallo]

when i set up my tank i installed a ball valve instead of a durso and it works great, i can raise the water level in my overflow and keep it quiet and still get plenty of flo thru it.

instead of a ball valve you mite want to get a quality gate valve, it makes for finer adjustments in the overflow.

 

[Anonymous]

when i set up my tank i installed a ball valve instead of a durso and it works great, i can raise the water level in my overflow and keep it quiet and still get plenty of flo thru it.

instead of a ball valve you mite want to get a quality gate valve, it makes for finer adjustments in the overflow.

I swear to god I have never seen a better plumbing job

Bryan

 

[Anonymous]

Is there any way that a ball/gate valve won't slow down the flow?

I can't see how that is possible

Bryan

 

[danmhippo]

Oh, man, that's a very outstanding plumbing job. Very clean and straight forward.

 

[Fishbreath]

Thanks very much for the 2 replies. So far the opinions 50-50 for/against the ball valve. Ha! Ernie, I do like the Ken Stockman version of a more compact silencer. My corner overflow is only 5.5" x 5.5" in my 60 gal. tank. I missed that in my searching...thanks for the link. Tony, your tank with a ball valve is impressive. How long has the tank been running and do you have to tinker with the overflow water level very often? Are you using a safety back-up path? That's a great looking system. I wish my plumbing looked that good.

 

[esmithiii]

Is there any way that a ball/gate valve won't slow down the flow?

I can't see how that is possible

Bryan

If you look through a ball valve when it is totally open, it is as slick and straight as a piece of pipe. When the ball valve is open, it does not restrict flow at all. You can throttle it back to restrict flow some, but it is not as precise as a gate valve.

Ernie

 

[Anonymous]

What I am getting at, is if you are using a valve to slow the flow up enough to fill the pipe with water, you are cutting down on the flowrate right?

Bryan

 

[esmithiii]

That is correct. When you close the ball valve just enough so that it matches the flow rate of the pump, you eliminate gurgling and excessive noise.

Ernie

 

[Anonymous]

The idea of using anything that blocks the drain line scares me, but I am a worse case kind of guy.

It is neat that you can raise or lower the water level in the overflow with it, but you can do the same thing with a repair coupling on a durso.

 

[DustinDorton]

Using a ballvalve to slow down a gravity drain is a terrible, TERRIBLE idea. I and others constantly point this out, yet people still seem to suggest it.
At some point, something is going to travel down that drainline that wasnt supposed to. A fish, a snail, a clump of algae, who knows. Everyone of those things stands a very good chance of jamming up in that ballvalve. When that happens your sump will continue to pump into the tank and it will overflow all over the place. A gravity fed drain line needs to be as large and unobstructed as possible, period. I have learned my lesson with this many times over.

If you need to raise the water level in your overflow use a durso standpipe. If you dont have room for one you can just put a regular standpipe in there. Anything is better than a ballvalve.

 

[esmithiii]

Using a ballvalve to slow down a gravity drain is a terrible, TERRIBLE idea. I and others constantly point this out, yet people still seem to suggest it.
At some point, something is going to travel down that drainline that wasnt supposed to. A fish, a snail, a clump of algae, who knows. Everyone of those things stands a very good chance of jamming up in that ballvalve. When that happens your sump will continue to pump into the tank and it will overflow all over the place. A gravity fed drain line needs to be as large and unobstructed as possible, period. I have learned my lesson with this many times over.

If you need to raise the water level in your overflow use a durso standpipe. If you dont have room for one you can just put a regular standpipe in there. Anything is better than a ballvalve.

I concur 100%.

Ernie

 

[t gallo]

well even a durso can get clogged with snails algae etc etc. this works great for me and has in the past.

nothing is fool proof, you must always, on a daily basis check the tank anyway for feeding routine maintnance etc. i have never had a problem with this method and would also suggest you incorperate the biggest diameter drain pipe possiblle to further youre success.

 

[t gallo]

i agree, the durso is the better way to go .

in my case i have a (2) two inch drain and with the amount of water draining i only need to close the ball valve very very little to raise the water level in the overflow , now this works for me but i dont recomend it.

 

[DustinDorton]

A durso can get plugged, I have had this happen too. But the smallest point in a durso stand pipe is the same as the bulkhead. If your going to get a snail in drain with a durso standpipe, it wouldnt have passed through the bulkhead, or the rest of the pipe after it for that matter. The snail would get stuck inside the durso stand pipe, not half way down your line wedged into a ballvalve.
If you get something something down a drain line with a ball valve you have a problem on your hands, regardless of checking the tank daily.
Its only going to take a few seconds for the tank to overflow and our pumps to run dry if a snail gets in there.

A ballvalve is the wrong way to fix the problem and should never be recommended. If you are looking for a fool proof way to keep your line from getting plugged, you need a standpipe with holes drilled up the side and an open top just in case.

 

[esmithiii]

A stockman standpipe has worked very well for me. The geometry of the pipe makes it hard to block.

Ernie

 

[ScottC]

If you decide to go with a valve, I'd recommend a gate valve. You can finely tune in the desired flow, and the valve will not move on you. Ball valves, either true union or utility, will move over time due to the flow of water.

Even in ths big system there is a 4" gate valve under the tank upstairs to control the gurgling.

 

[Fishbreath]

Ok I'm going with a Durso. I like the thought of screening out smaller objects like snails and strings of algae so I'm going to add an intake strainer similar to the custom one by Brian Schott, shown on Richard Durso's web site. (Link already posted previously in this thread). The advantage I see of picking a Durso over a Stockman is the intake is in plain view if you use the strainer idea shown in the link, with or without foam. My problem is space. I can use the recommended 1-1/4 inch standpipe but I have to transition to 1" PVC for the side stuff (elbow and input strainer). Others have posted here that that worked for them so I'll give it a shot. If not, guess the Stockman is the way to go. thanks for the good advice.

 

[Anonymous]

If you decide to go with a valve, I'd recommend a gate valve. You can finely tune in the desired flow, and the valve will not move on you. Ball valves, either true union or utility, will move over time due to the flow of water.

Even in ths big system there is a 4" gate valve under the tank upstairs to control the gurgling.

That is quite a setup, can't wait to show the wife, she will go thru the roof.

I think there is quite a difference between using a valve on a 1" or 1.5" drain line and using one on a 4" line. How many snails would it take to clog that 4" valve? Quite a few whereas it wouldn't take but 1 or 2 to completely clog the 1"

Bryan