Do you have the copperband in Qtank? or main tank? This is what happened with my copperband which I have now over 8 years. I put him as quick as possible in to main tank.(Not in a qtank.) He did not eat for about 3-4 days I gave him live brine which he slowly took, then he started picking on my rocks. Then I gave frozen bloodworms he loved them and I never looked back. He eats all frozen goods but not pellets or flakes. Going up and down the tank is a bit of a worry.I have seen that only rarely. Have you got rocks in the tank so he can rest in a quiet spot?
New Copperband - help Quarantining
- Thread starter Playdope
- Start date
It sure sounds to me like your quarantine tank is cycling. Check the ammonia and nitrites. When the fish goes to the surface and the gills move rapidly that can indicate a nitrite spike. That happened to me when I moved my tank and I had all of my fish in a temporary 20 gal tank. My first clue that something was wrong was the fish stopped eating and several fish were near the surface breathing rapidly. These spikes can sneek up on you. I was checking the water for ammonia every day but negleted to check the nitrites often enough. In your case it doesn't sound like there is an established biological filter in your quarantine tank. Any live rock or carbon filters in the main tank? If so then your best bet would be to move him to the main tank ASAP, assuming the problem is water quality and not parasites. Since you have no other fish your main tank will now be your quarantine tank. But here's what I would do first. Using a process of elimination first confirm the problem is water quality using test kits. If the water is confirmed bad and the fish is clean of spots I'd move him now. If the test kits say your water is OK then I'd be suspicious of oodinium or ick and that's a tough call. You could keep him in the quarantine tank and add copper medication. But you'll need to provide a biological filter of some kind, watch the ammonia and nitrites carefully, don't overfeed and be prepared to do daily water changes. Good luck.
The only think worse that not quarantining is bad quarantining! The smartest approach is to have a full cycled and established medium sized aquarium ( 29 gallons for example) set up and running as a half-way house for new arrivals. This MUST be a system that produces water as good as - or better than- your main show aquarium.
In the case of delicate butterflies, the first week of ownership will determine if the fish will acclimate or simply fail. And protein nutrition is very important during this time as a condition known as General adaptive syndrome is unfortunately well established within the fish’s physiology
. I agree with some others here that live foods are usually best to stimulate the feeding response. With this particular species, a combination of - a resident live rock ( for picking and stimulating the feeding response) and live foods are really helpful. You will see the shy copperband become quite aggressive in its determination as it picks at the rock, proving it is hungry but has no way of knowing what to eat in captivity.
Along with the permanent quarantine setup, you should have a permanent brine shrimp hatchery . It doesn’t have to be exotic- you can buy a simple base with aeration device, that a plastic soda bottle screws onto and uses a cheap vibrator pump for aeration and current to keep eggs suspended. It takes about 36 hours to have a two -three day supply of food.
Slowing over a two week time frame, you can mix adult frozen brine and cyclopzzz to the live/ frozen mix.
And finally you can open a live clam or mussel and let it sit on the bottom a few hours a day- the copperband and other butterflies/ difficult angels will also pick at it and get some nutrition.
Copperbands are my favorite fish but they are hard to acclimate. Make sure the belly is not pinched when buying them or you will have an impossible battle to fight. The fish should also have a very bright luster. If it is dull or matt looking as opposed to glossy looking, pass on the fish.
Very Best of luck, James P
In the case of delicate butterflies, the first week of ownership will determine if the fish will acclimate or simply fail. And protein nutrition is very important during this time as a condition known as General adaptive syndrome is unfortunately well established within the fish’s physiology
. I agree with some others here that live foods are usually best to stimulate the feeding response. With this particular species, a combination of - a resident live rock ( for picking and stimulating the feeding response) and live foods are really helpful. You will see the shy copperband become quite aggressive in its determination as it picks at the rock, proving it is hungry but has no way of knowing what to eat in captivity.
Along with the permanent quarantine setup, you should have a permanent brine shrimp hatchery . It doesn’t have to be exotic- you can buy a simple base with aeration device, that a plastic soda bottle screws onto and uses a cheap vibrator pump for aeration and current to keep eggs suspended. It takes about 36 hours to have a two -three day supply of food.
Slowing over a two week time frame, you can mix adult frozen brine and cyclopzzz to the live/ frozen mix.
And finally you can open a live clam or mussel and let it sit on the bottom a few hours a day- the copperband and other butterflies/ difficult angels will also pick at it and get some nutrition.
Copperbands are my favorite fish but they are hard to acclimate. Make sure the belly is not pinched when buying them or you will have an impossible battle to fight. The fish should also have a very bright luster. If it is dull or matt looking as opposed to glossy looking, pass on the fish.
Very Best of luck, James P
Playdope":85kslbff said:
It sounds like Amyloodinium might be causing the breathing problems. The wite spots on the tail are likely Cryptocaryon. The bad news is that you fish is in the advanced stages of these diseases and may be difficult to save. I would treat with copper. If you did put him in the main tank, I would wait at least a month before adding any new fish. Learn from this experience and use it as a good excuse to get a general book on marine tanks with a chapter on marine diseases. There are many out there by authors like Moe, Fenner, Sprung, Delbeek, Tullock, Paletta, Nilsen, Fossa, etc. Going to the internet for troubleshooting help is great, but don't be afraid to crack a book. I use mine over and over again.
Mitch
Check the nitrite and ammonia level of the tank after removal of the fish to confirm if the death is due to cycling of the tank (inadequate bacteria to process the waste).
If it indeed is due to elevated level of ammonia and nitrite that put stress on the fish. You will be better prepared next time you get the next new fish.
Good luck to ya.
If it indeed is due to elevated level of ammonia and nitrite that put stress on the fish. You will be better prepared next time you get the next new fish.
Good luck to ya.
A quarantine tank is a death sentence unless it is reasonably well-established. The main reason to use one is to protect your other fish. My guess is it wasn't amyloodinium, cryptocarion or cyanide. It was likely ammonia and stress.
This is why I advised sticking him directly in the main system. I wouldn't drip-aclimate or mix the water in any other way, as ammonia in the water becomes more toxic as the pH increases. The CO2 the fish exhales makes the ammonia the fish excretes less toxic by lowering the pH and forcing more of it into the ammonium cation form, which is not toxic. Dissolved ammonia gas is liberated when the pH is raised, which then damages the fish.
This is why I advised sticking him directly in the main system. I wouldn't drip-aclimate or mix the water in any other way, as ammonia in the water becomes more toxic as the pH increases. The CO2 the fish exhales makes the ammonia the fish excretes less toxic by lowering the pH and forcing more of it into the ammonium cation form, which is not toxic. Dissolved ammonia gas is liberated when the pH is raised, which then damages the fish.
Playdope":3222zp31 said:Bad news... I woke up this morning, and it didn't make it through the night. My only guess is it was collected with cyanide.
From the information you have provided there is no basis to draw this conclusion. Moving the fish through the chain of custody is a stressful process. Take some solace in the fact that they are widespread and very successful in the wild. I frequently see them as the most common butterfly on price lists. They were also one of the butterflies coming into the trade as MAC certified. It would be interesting to learn how many were able to remain certifed through out the chain. This is a fish that may well end up on an unsuitable species list one day and it will not be the fault of cyanide.
Mitch
I agree with Wgscott and dizzy, Your copperband was so stressed with all the moves, and if the water in the qtank was bad would ad even more stress. It does not mean he had parasites. I read some were that all fish carry white spot but it takes exstreem stress to show and cause disaster.I tend to agree with that therie.If you have a very well established tank with all parameters at zero with rocks and corals a fish would feel at home and not get stressed. Of course when you buy any fish study him for a while and see how he is behaving and how his gill movements are.Dont buy if he looks at all nervous or stressed. This has all ways worked for me in 14 years of marine keeping.I have never and mean never had any desease out break, I am very proud of that. Per haps it also has to do with that I use nsw, that I store and filter in a big vat before using it for water changes.
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