New Turf Results

[Anonymous]

Santa Monica: Not sure if you're still reading this, but...

Keep in mind this is an open forum where the free exchange of ideas is welcome. It's here to help everybody progress in the hobby. If you feel you were treated unfairly, then by all means explain your position again. However you should also remember that the severity of criticism an idea receives is directly related to the claims of said idea. Ergo, Bold Claims=Bold Criticsm. You've made some pretty bold claims. The bold criticism you received was justified (and backed up by decades of collective experience) and it does not help your case to suggest that new readers ignore it.

 

[Anonymous]

i'm still waiting to see a mature sps dominated tank that uses nothing but a turf scrubber with no water changes or skimming-until i see some pics/proofs/true results, i'm going to find every single forum you've posted on and challenge you fair and square as i've done here previously

ALL you've done so far is show that you can grow algae on a screen in a high nutrient tank environment-we've all know this to be the case for decades

Please at least get ADEY'S name correctly-a noob like you constantly mispelling his name shows what lack of respect you have for someone, who, while being mistaken himself about quite alot of things regarding turf scrubbers and plenums vis-a-vis closed systems, has decades over you on this very subject, and is far more aware of what scrubbers are than you

you really shoud read 'dynamic aquaria' by Adey

http://www.amazon.com/dp/0120437929/?tag=reefs04-20

you will see that you have 'discovered' nothing new here

 

[Anonymous]

:lol: He's pointing to enteromorpha and calling it turf algae :lol:

Oh please tell me how you think it lives.

 

[SnowManSnow]

oh be nice.

 

[Ben1]

Vitz has got a lot of posting to do lol..

http://www.thereeftank.com/forums/f6/me ... 19583.html

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/sh ... ?p=1601068

http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forums/nan ... -free.html

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.p ... pic=168137

http://www.reeflounge.com/showthread.php?p=202960

http://www.aquaria.info/index.php?name= ... ic&t=71607

http://www.reefaquariumguide.com/forum/ ... post1.html

http://www.3reef.com/forums/i-made/mega ... 51120.html

http://www.reefcove.co.uk/forums/index. ... entry18156

http://forum.marinedepot.com/Topic89570-4-1.aspx

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f1 ... 05133.html

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showt ... id=1424843

http://www.talkingreef.com/forums/gener ... 2-4-a.html

http://www.reeferscafe.com/reef-discuss ... thing.html

http://www.saltwaterfish.com/vb/showthr ... b&t=330606

and RDO, that 16 forums! WOW! That is some dedication. Sorry RDO mods for all the links. Santa you missed reef2reef.com lol.

In a classic case of "not doing research", some anti-turf folks on another site have ended up helping out the turf scene. They are constantly accusing pro-turf or pro-algae folks, and especially anti-skimmer folks, of not having research. So they post a research video from the College of Marine Science (U of S. FL, St. Petersburg) on that site, which is supposed to prove with research that algae, especially turf, kills corals. Yes. Then they
follow it up with "So I guess you didn't watch the video, right?"

Well. I took the time to watch it (one hour). But, I guess they did NOT. The video starts out appearing to make the point of "algae kills corals", and if you stopped watching after fifteen minutes, that's what you'd think. But the first part of that presentation is just a setup for the presenter's further explanations, and is not the point itself.

I like how you continue to twist this all over the net, gotta give it to you though you are very persistent. :roll:

 

[ZooKeeper1]

LOL. I think most of the video went over his head.

ABSTRACT
Declines in coral cover are generally associated with increases in the abundance of fleshy algae. In many cases, it remains unclear whether algae are responsible, directly or indirectly, for coral death or whether they simply settle on dead coral surfaces. Here, we show that algae can indirectly cause coral mortality by enhancing microbial activity via the release of dissolved compounds. When coral and algae were placed in chambers together but separated by a 0.02 μm filter, corals suffered 100% mortality. With the addition of the broad-spectrum antibiotic ampicillin, mortality was completely prevented. Physiological measurements showed complementary patterns of increasing coral stress with proximity to algae. Our results suggest that as human impacts increase and algae become more abundant on reefs a positive feedback loop may be created whereby compounds released by algae enhance microbial activity on live coral surfaces causing mortality of corals and further algal growth.

corals died when placed adjacent to macroalgae, even when separated by a 0.02 µm membrane that was impermeable to viruses and microbes, but not dissolved compounds like DOC. The algae increased microbial growth on the coral, which in turn caused hypoxia and presumably the coral mortality. Coral mortality did not occur in this experiment when antibiotics were added [77]. These results suggest that algal-derived DOC may be a primary driver of coral-microbial interactions. In addition, algae-associated microbial communities harbor pathogens that cause coral disease [78].

Especially this part

These results suggest that algal-derived DOC may be a primary driver of coral-microbial interactions. In addition, algae-associated microbial communities harbor pathogens that cause coral disease

 

[Anonymous]

http://www.reefs.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=1495021#1495021

 

[trilinearmipmap]

This thread shows why this forum has gone from a leading internet reef forum to a forum ignored by 99.9% of reefers.

When I started researching my first reef tank about six years ago this forum was had a stature equal to RC. In fact I felt that this forum generally had more thoughtful posts and valuable information than the other forum

Things have gone downhill badly here. I am not sure when. I rarely visit this forum any more and the sort of mudslinging I see in this thread is one of the reasons why.

There are good points and bad points about this guy's turf algae filter. A healthy debate and discussion would benefit everyone here. However the criticisms of his threads are nothing short of moronic. I have no respect for people who post personal attacks against others on this or any other web forum.

Quite simply, this forum is no longer relevant for most reefers, largely because of the moronic sort of posts contained in this and other threads. That is why I no longer spend time on this forum. Interestingly while I stayed away from RC for many months, recently I have been back there and the levels of discussion and information there has improved markedly.

In short this forum is a sinking ship populated by rats.

I should note that I do not know the original poster, and I do not have a turf scrubber although I am considering building one.

 

[Anonymous]

This thread shows why this forum has gone from a leading internet reef forum to a forum ignored by 99.9% of reefers.

When I started researching my first reef tank about six years ago this forum was had a stature equal to RC. In fact I felt that this forum generally had more thoughtful posts and valuable information than the other forum

Things have gone downhill badly here. I am not sure when. I rarely visit this forum any more and the sort of mudslinging I see in this thread is one of the reasons why.

There are good points and bad points about this guy's turf algae filter. A healthy debate and discussion would benefit everyone here. However the criticisms of his threads are nothing short of moronic. I have no respect for people who post personal attacks against others on this or any other web forum.

Quite simply, this forum is no longer relevant for most reefers, largely because of the moronic sort of posts contained in this and other threads. That is why I no longer spend time on this forum. Interestingly while I stayed away from RC for many months, recently I have been back there and the levels of discussion and information there has improved markedly.

In short this forum is a sinking ship populated by rats.

I should note that I do not know the original poster, and I do not have a turf scrubber although I am considering building one.

did you read the outlandish title of the original thread ?

did you read the link that completely dismisses the entire premise of the thread title/first posts of santa's ?

did you notice how not ONE reply was made to any factual challenge presented here to santa, and that he blatantly and completely misrepresented the replies made here to other bb's, without even providing links so others could see EXACTLY what was said by the 'critics' ?

do you applaude self imposed ignorance, and encouraging others to be so as well?


obviously, countering nonsense, outlandish claims, blatently false statements with research and experience isn't your cup of tea

e-i'm a tad confused, - if you're one of the ones 'running away' from here, are you a rat by your own definition ? :? :roll:

 

[Ben1]

In short this forum is a sinking ship populated by rats.

To each their own. I personally trust the people that post here more then the ones on other forums. I feel I know the people that post here regularly better and know they have knowledge that can be trusted. Skim over all the RDO post and you will very rarely get a case like this. This happens on a daily basis on boards like RC, just their mods are fast to close the thread and ban the members.

RDO lets us have some free speech to a point (more then any other internet board) , I've been posting on RDO for long enough to see its not a sinking ship. Its the first forum I come to when I need a solid bit of info, not 10 opinions from people who set up a tank a month ago and rediscovered the wheel.

Like I said to each their own.

 

[Anonymous]

...I have no respect for people who post personal attacks against others on this or any other web forum.

In short this forum is a sinking ship populated by rats.

 

[Anonymous]

In short this forum is a sinking ship populated by rats.

Thanks, pass the cheese while you're at it

I should note that I do not know the original poster, and I do not have a turf scrubber although I am considering building one.

Then you should read the postings here, and elsewhere BTW-RDO is not the only board to take issue with the OP or his presentation- that point out the inherent flaws and limitations in ATS systems. No one system is the 100% perfect way for 100% of the tanks out there.

But what do a bunch of rats know

 

[Anonymous]

I'll take some cheese please. Sharp chedder if I may :wink: .

SM - if you're reading this, you should unblock all of those people you chose to ignor on that other forum. We're having a dandy time discussing this without you there to get in the way. The funniest part about it is the fact that you PM'd each of us to request our input on your thread. Now you've blocked us because you don't appreciate our opinions. :lol:

---edit---Sorry guys/gals, of all the times I've been here I've never posted? Well, now the seal has been broken!

 

[Anonymous]

Post #2. I've got to say...I'm impressed by some of the intelligent and well developed responses in this thread. Not bad for a bunch of rats.

John Henry - I read this one to my wife...she was very impressed by the choice of words.

"Keep in mind this is an open forum where the free exchange of ideas is welcome. It's here to help everybody progress in the hobby. If you feel you were treated unfairly, then by all means explain your position again. However you should also remember that the severity of criticism an idea receives is directly related to the claims of said idea. Ergo, Bold Claims=Bold Criticsm. You've made some pretty bold claims. The bold criticism you received was justified (and backed up by decades of collective experience) and it does not help your case to suggest that new readers ignore it."

 

[Anonymous]

Santa Monica: Not sure if you're still reading this, but...

Keep in mind this is an open forum where the free exchange of ideas is welcome. It's here to help everybody progress in the hobby. If you feel you were treated unfairly, then by all means explain your position again. However you should also remember that the severity of criticism an idea receives is directly related to the claims of said idea. Ergo, Bold Claims=Bold Criticsm. You've made some pretty bold claims. The bold criticism you received was justified (and backed up by decades of collective experience) and it does not help your case to suggest that new readers ignore it.

Very well said.

 

[Anonymous]

I'll take some cheese please. Sharp chedder if I may :wink: .

SM - if you're reading this, you should unblock all of those people you chose to ignor on that other forum. We're having a dandy time discussing this without you there to get in the way. The funniest part about it is the fact that you PM'd each of us to request our input on your thread. Now you've blocked us because you don't appreciate our opinions. :lol:

---edit---Sorry guys/gals, of all the times I've been here I've never posted? Well, now the seal has been broken!

:welcome:

...happy to see you posting!

I am glad you and others have taken up the discussion with SM. I tried in the original thread here and quickly tired of hyperbole and runaround and dogmatic digging in. Its really too bad because the waterfall is interesting, but the snake oil pitch makes it hard to swallow.

Anyway, welcome again and I am enjoying your posts in that other place.

 

[Anonymous]

Santa Monica has just been banned over at RC.

 

[Anonymous]

Anyway, welcome again and I am enjoying your posts in that other place.

Yes, welcome miwoodar! Thanks for coming over.

btw, you know me as TS over on that 'other site.'

 

[Anonymous]

Hey Craig - nice to meet over here! Thanks Thales. I still can't believe that I have never posted over here. The AA magazine is great BTW. The depth of coverage in many of the articles is primo.

You know, I had casually logged onto that thread again and again but always got bored by the one sided banter. I guess last week I dug in and reviewed the entire thing and got fairly fired up. I actually have a lot of sympathy for SM...I went through a very similar gate at about two years into the hobby. What I think he's missing more than anything else is a lack of appreciation for what he doesn't know (what is that called, humility?). I think most of us enter the hobby completely oblivious. After a while we have done enough research and have had enough success that we think we have it all figured out. It's kind of like the know-it-all teenager stereotype. Over time though you mature to the point that you realize you're just learning what other people have already learned (or discovered) and all of our experiences are overlapping in a gazillion ways. Nobody can know it all. There's just too much to learn and too much left to be discovered. Experts in specific disiplines, absolutely. Most experts are the first to point you to someone else, or present someone else's logic, when they know they aren't the best person to respond though. Anyhoo, I haven't read this months AA - gonna go give it a browse!

 

[Anonymous]

Anyway, welcome again and I am enjoying your posts in that other place.

Yes, welcome miwoodar! Thanks for coming over.

btw, you know me as TS over on that 'other site.'

Yes indeedy, glad to have you aboard the sinking ship . Oh, and I have a few other names on those few other places but I'll let ya'll figure it out