Start a new reef tank!! How?

[John Kh]

Hello!!!

I have a new almost 350G total reef system size that will arrive hopefully the coming Saturday. I need to start it and start it correctly. Can anyone tell me how to do it in easy steps? Like how to cycle the water? And when to place the first fish? Live rocks? Which one goes first? Do I use water conditioner like Aqua Safe or Safe Start (Terta)? Do I use Bacteria Icons? ....

 

[Ben1]

DO you have the live rock already? If not I would order it ASAP. If adding sand do it first...I would fill the tank 90% full with mixed SW, add the LR if this makes the tank overflow a little it will go to your sump. Then I would go to add enough water to get the sump running and make sure the return pump and circulation pumps are all running. Then I would wait 30 days and test for ammonia and nitrite, which at that point should be 0. Then I would add my fish a few at a time, with the order depending on the species. IF the LR is fully cured and has little die off you may need to add some table shrimp to help the cycle, if the LR is not cured or raw rock then it should do the trick on its own. Thats a very basic breakdown.

 

[John Kh]

I do have some LR now and intending to buy more. They are Cured, or let me say Half Cured. I buy them directly from the store where they have been installed in the store's tank!! So I added water and Mix it with Salt and then add the sand and wait for a month!! Do I need to add any fish first to stabilize the cycle or what so ever? When I first got a tank, I have been told to install a couple of Damsels or Chromis!! To fasten the cycle!!

 

[rbursek]

John,
I do not want this to sound rude, but your buying a 350gal reef tank and have no idea what to do. It sounds like you have read nothing on this subject!!!! First you need to have a RO/DI for pure water unless you have another source of known pure water. Once that is established you need to add the salt to the water not vise versa. You know this is a waste of my time, there are so many things you need to read up on before you do anything first that can not all be explained here on a forum post, I am sorry, but get some books on a reef set up and read before you even add water to your tank. After reading them then post questions on specifics. Sounds like an April Fools Thread!
Sorry, but just can not handle a thread like this.
Bob

 

[rbursek]

Ya, add Damsils, " Devil fish" and then post here how to get them out of the tank without tearing it down to catch them. Read, Read, Read, before even adding the water. PLEASE!!!
Bob

 

[John Kh]

LOL, Thank you anyway.

I already know what to do but I was looking for a more simple way. When I started my first it was OK, not a big success at first but went fine after sometime. Now that I am getting a new tank, I just wanted a simple safe way and some opinions!!!

Concerning adding Damsels, some suggest to add some and others mention it as a big NO. I added some myself and they were OK after I added tank mate in a while. But I wanted a more practical way and less cruel for them!!! That's the whole idea.

I have books, I bought 4 actually!!! And I read a lot concerning the subject. But, on the other hand, I would like to hear some people who has experience about the subject, to act/ react, and make a conversation, not only read and apply. Not everything you read is right after all. Anyway SORRY that the post bothered you.

 

[blackcloudmedia]

Wow rbursek, testy much? Is this how you treat all threads from new members? The OP doesnt sound like a joker at all, he just sounds like the typical new guy that has recieved bad info from LFS as usual. To the OP...be careful adding "junk" fish to the tank to cycle it. I did this as well many years ago and the ones that lived I could never get out. Damsels are a++ holes and will beat on any fish. If I were you I would go over to the new reafkeeping forums and browse through the archive. Be warned though in a tank that size, expenses increase.

 

[rbursek]

I guess I miss understood the scope of the original post. John I am sorry for being so apprupt.
Bob

 

[Anonymous]

I do have some LR now and intending to buy more. They are Cured, or let me say Half Cured. I buy them directly from the store where they have been installed in the store's tank!! So I added water and Mix it with Salt and then add the sand and wait for a month!! Do I need to add any fish first to stabilize the cycle or what so ever? When I first got a tank, I have been told to install a couple of Damsels or Chromis!! To fasten the cycle!!

No fish (demand) in the system (on the system), no cycling. In other words, there are only enough nitrifying bacteria present to consume the available nutrients. So, no fish, no cycle.

You could even use wild (black, no fancy fins) mollies to start the cycle, then let them become food for the system.

 

[Ben1]

No fish (demand) in the system (on the system), no cycling. In other words, there are only enough nitrifying bacteria present to consume the available nutrients. So, no fish, no cycle.

I personally perfer raw LR or throwing some raw table shrimp in there. It does the same thing, with out the need to kill mollies or have damsels live through a cycle and be stuck with them. Just add the mixed SW, LR, table shrimp and wait about a month while testing for ammonia or nitrite, once you see the spike go from Ammonia-Nitrite-Nitrate they cycle is started. Once the Ammonia hits 0 and the nitrite hits 0 you can start adding a few fish at a time spaced out by ATLEAST a few weeks to allow your bacteria to compensate for the new load on the system.

If you plan on adding sand I suggest adding it first, then while adding water have a large ceramic plate or something similair in the tank. This way when you add the water you can pour it ontop of the plate and you won't get as much of a sand storm. If you are using sand your other option is to sink the bags to the bottom then slice the bottom of the bag and pull it out, that can help also. The other way you might wan't to go is to set the tank up first, once all the plumbing is done water test everything for a day. Let the system run, check for leaks in all your plumbing. I am assuming in a tank that size it will be Reef ready and have a sump. This allows you to check and fix and leaks before anything gets going. If you filled the tank with RO/DI then add your salt to the tank and make sure it is mixed well. Check with your refractometer and add the sand if its not already in there. If the tank is cloudy from the sand you can add the LR in a pile on the bottom and do your aquascape once it clears up but I perfer setting my Aquascape up dry first if possible and then knowing where to place everything once the tank is ready. Once the water is clear and you have your LR in place add the raw shrimp, maybe a couple for such a large tank and get your test kits.

You would be smart to get a fish want list together, and then we can help you with what order they should go in. If the LR you get has been sitting curing in your dealers tank there won't be much die off and an additional source of nutrients will be needed to complete the cycle as SeaMaiden was saying, this is where the raw shrimp, mollies, damsels, whatever you use comes into play.

Have you put any thought into what you are going to want fish wise? Are you planning on combining your old tank into this one or do you currently not have a tank running?

 

[Anonymous]

I think that in a 350 gallon system a handful of mollies is unlikely to cause such a spike in toxic nitrogenous wastes as to kill them. I've seen (large) systems started with urine. :lol:

 

[John Kh]

I guess I miss understood the scope of the original post. John I am sorry for being so apprupt.
Bob

Do not worry, it is OK.

 

[John Kh]

You would be smart to get a fish want list together, and then we can help you with what order they should go in. If the LR you get has been sitting curing in your dealers tank there won't be much die off and an additional source of nutrients will be needed to complete the cycle as SeaMaiden was saying, this is where the raw shrimp, mollies, damsels, whatever you use comes into play.

Have you put any thought into what you are going to want fish wise? Are you planning on combining your old tank into this one or do you currently not have a tank running?

I have like 5 fish in my current tank, 75G, plus like 50/60Kg of LR. In addition to some slugs, Crabs, Blennies, Gobies, Soft Corals, Hard Corals, and a white bubble tip anemone I guess. I am planning on introducing them when the cycle is over, within like 2 months or so. I do not want to make the same mistake I made when I first started my current tank. Because I went like crazy buying all kind of fish and installing them... And they kept on dieing and dieing. Anyway I ended up with those fish now:
1 Chocolate Tang which is Yellow.
2 Two Banded Clown.
1 weird Black & White Clown with a Yellow tail, I assume it is an African Clown but coulnd't be sure of it
1 Spotted Hawk Fish.
2 Bicolor Blennies, One I see often wandering around, the other which is a very small one and recently got, I haven't seen him around since I introduced him.
1 Yellow Wrasse which I also haven't seen since the Hawk Fish hit on him.
2 Gobbies.
1 Bubble Tip Anemone.
1 Decorator Crab.
Some corals: Mushroom, brain, disk, bubble...
Some feather duster worms...
Some slugs...

Concerning what I really want!! I mostly like Tangs!! So I would like to have:
Yellow Tang of course. I also like the Purple one and the Sailfin (I had one and she died) ===> I would choose 2 of those 3 but not sure whether they get along.
I like Dory, the Blue Tang tang ===> I think I will get 2 of this.
The Lined Surgeon is also wonderful and moves in a nice way ===>I would get one I guess.
A couple of Percula would be nice too ===> I would get 2 False Percula maybe.
I love blennies and gobies ===> I will try to get some.
As I mentioned before I would like to see some sort of a group so it might be a Chromis (7 or maybe 8) or Cardinals (7 or maybe 8)!! Still not sure yet.
I am also open to any nice addition I might find interesting!! Maybe an Anthias Couple would be nice to add later on!! Fox Face might be OK... But I am not sure about those. You can suggest some I would be glad to hear your suggestion about what can I install in there

 

[pcardone]

my best suggestion is to take your time, let the tank evolve slowly

 

[Ben1]

Post your list in a new thread WHich order should I add these type thread and more people will help.

I didnt realize you were combining tanks if I did I would have had you do it differently. I recently combined a 58 into a 160. Heres the build thread topic129222-20.html the thing I had going for me was I had my live rock curing in tubs with heater, protein skimmer, and some light for months before I set the tank up. This allowed me a setup where I knew all the Live rock was clean and would have no die off and already had some bacteria in place. Anyhow nothing wrong with taking your time and getting it right.

 

[Anonymous]

John, this may be a weird idea, but I tell ya, it's beautiful when you see such displays in public aquariums. Have you considered for schooling fish some kind of small bait fish? Tropical tolerant or tropical species, of course, but if you could install say a dozen or so, something similar to anchovies or sardines, it could be quite dramatic.

Just thinking impulsively, I don't remember ever seeing anything like that come through anyplace I worked (outside the public aquarium).

 

[John Kh]

John, this may be a weird idea, but I tell ya, it's beautiful when you see such displays in public aquariums. Have you considered for schooling fish some kind of small bait fish? Tropical tolerant or tropical species, of course, but if you could install say a dozen or so, something similar to anchovies or sardines, it could be quite dramatic.

Just thinking impulsively, I don't remember ever seeing anything like that come through anyplace I worked (outside the public aquarium).

I didn't get your point?! Can you elaborate!!!Please.

Now anyway I had a fight with the owner of my apartment and he is not letting me fill the tank. He is afraid that the building will crash even though the pressure by the big tank is like 900Kg/M2 while the pressure of the current tank is like 650KgM2 Not much difference. Plus they are both sitting next to a bearing wall Which should be fine. But just looking at the HUGE size of the big tank is terrifying him and now he is visiting me 5 times each day just reminding me not to fill the tank, LOL. Any suggestion how to convince him? Or any solution? Change the apartment maybe?

 

[Anonymous]

The only thing I can think of John is to get a structural engineer to test your floor and write a report to put your landlord's mind at rest. Expensive maybe, but cheaper than moving house!

As for the bait fish idea, I think it's great (lots of small fish schooling), but anchovies and sardines wouldn't work (cold water fish). I think they were just examples SeaMaiden was using to give you an idea of the visual effect. I'm not sure what reef fish would play a similar role though.

 

[Anonymous]

Exactly, Tom. I was trying to find out what species of tropical bait fish there are, but I couldn't get any usable results doing the search the way I was.

John, oh Jesus! It's not on a second floor, is it? I thought it was going directly onto the slab. Just slap the landlord and tell him to stop being so silly. :lol:

 

[John Kh]

It is on the first floor actually and the tank will be placed next to a bearing wall on a surface area of at least 1.4 M2. But I think the owner was just terrified by the huge size and didn't realize the real proportion. I will take sometime maybe he can forget about the whole issue. Just needs to finish installing it anyway Still lots of devices to install

Thanks for the fish advise too