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zulu_principle

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Holy Crackers............

From the outside looking in, looking in foggy windows at the best of times.

Take a step back and look at what you have accomplished.

Those that look successful are not really successful, those that feel successful are.

This industry, as I have discovered, is filled with some strange birds I think all of those birds want to provide to the end consumer the best we can, not what the industry can.

Don't sweat the small stuff.

My 2 cents (canadian that is)


Wendell
 

dacarlson

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:) I post only on occasion but have followed this thread with much interested over the last few months and wanted to give my two cents. As previously stated this has been a topic of debate for years and will always be. I have run a home based business for the past 4 years and here is my take on the subject.

I believe there are a large number of home business shops that are home business because the area they live in will not support a store front. I live in an area that has 67,000 people within 50 miles. I have done 5 business plans in the last 10 years, and the numbers are just not there. Six stores have come and gone in the last 7 years in our area.

I feel I have done a great job in providing quality products and service to my clients. We live in a free market society and everyone has the right to do business in there own way providing it is legal. I have no problem with the wholesaler who will only sell to store fronts. That is their choice in doing business. I have not had any problem finding good sources for product, live or drygoods. All wholesale distributors will tell you they have quality product, only you will determine that by keeping good records.

If a wholesaler will not do business with me that is fine, there are plenty who will. The problem I have is with the wholesaler that wants the best of both worlds, selling wholesale and retail. My policy is, I will not buy from them.

For those of you that are upset with the store front policy, quit complaining and do a little research. You can run a successful home base business. I DO!
 

MaryHM

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Question for all the home based business owners (and I know there are lots of legit ones out there):

As a wholesaler, how am I supposed to tell the difference between a legit home based business and a hobbyist with a business license? Also, how am I to know if a home based business is even a legal operation, as many parts of the country do not allow businesses to be operated in residentially zoned areas?
 

dacarlson

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How do you know a home base business is legit? You don't. No more than you know a storefront is legit, unless you fly to their location and see for yourself. In the day of high tech digital equipment I could easily send you a picture of my storefront, tank displays etc.

I am always truthful right up front when I contact a wholesaler. If they will sell to me fine, if not I look somewhere else. I purchase about 40% of my dry goods from the manufacture, is this fair to the wholesaler? As some one said earlier in the thread, if a business has a licence, can show a bank statement, possibly email pictures of their holding systems, meet your minimum order requirements, they are legit. The government sure thinks I'm legit, they take their share of my profits and sales tax every quarter.

The bottom line, how do you know, you don't. You set your business policies and you live or die by them. I am in an industry (my home base business is part time) that has seen the manufacture sell only to authorize resellers for years but has slowly bypassed them and now sells direct to the consumer. I think it is only a matter of time when the exporter, the manufacture will bypass the wholesaler and sell direct to the reseller and consumer. All business is driven by the $$, whether we want to admit it or not.

Well I have given my second two cents.
 

Oldguy

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Mary,
While do agree with it is your business as you want. You ask how can you tell who is legit and who is not. That is up to the State that gave out the business license not you.
I do agree that some hobbyists will go through the hassle to get a license, I don't see them as being a big problem to most stores as that same hobbyist would most likely by it MO anyway.
The reason I say this is that to buy wholesale and save you need to get a larger order. If your only doing 1or 2 peices then shipping is a killer.
To say that you have a storefront you are legit is not a ture judge.
There is store around here that do not have any SW in the store but will pick up what you want at the local wholesaler for $5.00 over the total cost.
So how do you decide you cannot. I just upset when people tell me that I am not a true business because I dont have a storefront.

dacarlson
You are right there are many other places to buy from.
 
A

Anonymous

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You are right there are many other places to buy from.

OK then, lets stop beating a dead horse, and leave it at that.

Wholesalers sell to whom they want

and

retaillers (including home business) can buy from whom they want excluding those who won't sell to them.[/quote]
 

AquariaUSA

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Although I missed the boat, I have been in this industry for over 10 years with a few different retailers, wholesalers, organizations, etc. and have established companies that operate in a few states (legally!). However, the directory comment was ridiculous!!! "must be listed with your local phone directory service. That pretty much means you're a legitimate business"

I incorporated my first aquarium service business in 1995 that fed off of several area retailers. At that time, there were at least 10 service companies listed in the phonebook, in a very large metropolitan area. There were also about 15 retail stores listed. Our business paid a hefty price for one of those "yellowbook" adds, and received retail based questions like "what fishbowls do you stock" on a weekly basis, which obviously ran our business phoneline rates through the roof.

Today if you pick up the yellow pages, you will not find any listings for service companies, and the retail aquarium trade has narrowed itself down to 5 advertising stores. Most have switched to other forms of revenue generating advertising (tv, radio, direct mail, etc.) Our company has a very organized direct contact marketing program, in which we invest about $250-500 per month on, in addition to qtrly advertising, shows, etc. We will not use yellow page advertising due to its proven low ROI that we tracked on several occasions. So does that make us a garage based business? Well, with about 1500 gallons at one location, and 3000 at another for propagation and holding, maybe it does, but then again most of our livestock is far healthier than most retailers, thus which helps us to continue ordering from our suppliers on a monthly basis.

On a weekly basis we visit our local retailers in 4 major cities, only to witness bleached corals, and ich-ridden fish, etc. Point I am trying to really make is... wholesale can save retailers money, help wholesalers meet order quotas...but what is it doing to the reefs when a new hobbyist helps keep the local retailer selling his weekly shipment, only to kill the organism within a weeks time? Our clients average about a 5% qtrly mortality rate versus the astonomical death rates the retailer and its customers provide. It's not about how many boxes you order, or how many bricks you build with mortar, but how many things live after the consumer places the fish or coral in their aquarium. If all goes well the customer returns to the store, but then again, those that kill everything off usually return as well. What a great business! However, I would like to be able to sell our clients something in the next few years, so it would help all of us to keep the dedicated service companies with several avenues to fullfill our orders. Anyone know of a good wholesaler who sells to dedicated service companies? :O) We have about 65 high-end clients in 6 states, who all purchase a fair amount of marine livestock from our home-based businesses. And the funny thing is, business licenses can be cheap, but most retailers pay on average $1,200 to have a lawyer get them one. Some of us are a bit smarter, we spend the money saved on education and marketing. hehe
 

MaryHM

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However, the directory comment was ridiculous!!! "must be listed with your local phone directory service. That pretty much means you're a legitimate business"

Local directory service means 411. Any business with a business phone line is listed with 411. You don't pay for it, it's not an ad. That is what I meant.

I don't know anyone who would pay a lawyer to get a business license. That's usually a simple matter of walking into the county clerk's office.
 

AquariaUSA

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Hiya Mary! Some of us are smarter than others when it comes to licensing, etc. but I know of 3 retail locations that had used lawyers to setup their entire structure with boilerplates to "inc" and obtain local and state permits...the cheapest spent $1,200 to my amazement. As for 411, that is great too if you are mainly retail oriented with a store front, but honestly we do not want to attract clients outside of our client base, which may be the case of the original posting by the other service company. I am not sure how your company (or the company you work for?) deals with wholesale accounts, and honestly I try to avoid any bias when searching for alternate suppliers, but the post about "legitimacy" kinda brings the fire and brimstone to many :O) Having a central business line at the home office, or a showroom location is great if you want to staff the phone (i.e. hiring an office manager or secretary), but for the past five years we have used five cell phones (with the same numbers) that each of us carry around 24 hours a day. These numbers are also engrained in our regional advertising promotions, so as to get the word out and provide basic services that most answering machine retail establishments use during non-standard business hours. Since the original post was somewhat dated, you may or may not want to post your company's wholesale policy/requirements for any reading the rest of this thread. In the end wholesale, retail, part-time services provided by hobbyists, and full-time service companies are all very different entities, and each have a specific niche they operate in, order for, and levels of service that are provided... I know that our number one issue is finding a wholesaler or retailer that stocks quality livestock, is educated on what they stock (mortality issues, etc.), and consistent in the delivery of quality. And for those out there that think that we just want to avoid "the middle man" retailer, we spend on average about $500-1000 each month at area stores during the weekly "cherry-pick event" for large specimens, but honestly we are trying our best to provide at least 75% captive bred corals for our clients exhibits. We can't grow everything, although it is an idea for 2004, so we too need to find decent wholesalers. We wish all of you the best of luck no matter what sales channel you are in! Educate the consumer, and all of us will stay in business!!!
 

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