How many of you B&M stores order from multiple places?

[Anonymous]

Do you think it's a necessity?

Also, whom are the top 5-10 wholesalers out there?

I was thinking about this, and don't think I can even *name* 10 of them. Are there more?

SDC, ERI, MSI, ORA, Dynasty, Segrest (ugh), QM, Fishheds (still out there?)...and....ummm...

Right now I order from SDC and ORA and that's it. I'll possibly need to expand that when our new system is online, because it's 3x the size of the current one.

Peace,

Chip

 

[Anonymous]

Thats all you can name? You really need to pick up a FAMA, you'll find a few more in there 104th has quite a few more on it then you've listed, not to mention the 20-30 others of various sizes in the US. I can think of 2 in NY as well.

Sorry, I think I'm the wrong person to answer this one.

 

[Anonymous]

Well, I meant wholesalers with enough quantity and turnover to get stuff I want. That's why I put the "ugh" next to Segrest. While a large wholesaler, I'd had lists from them and never saw anything other than bread-n-butter very basic things. When I want bellus angels, red & white marbled scolymias, etc, etc...I can't exactly order from Segrest.

Peace,

Chip

 

[JennM]

Yes I think it's a necessity, because it's not wise to put all your eggs in one basket.

I'm not going to add to the list of names, because I don't want to give away the names of the good ones, and I don't want to seem to plug the bad ones :lol: But there are many more out there.

I find things with one that I might not find with another... everybody's buying habits are different. I deal with small comanies where the service is a lot more personal and I find the quality better because usually the person I speak with (is usually the owner) and they are also the person who picks and packs my order...

Have never received a yellow tang instead of a yellow-eyed tang from them

Jenn

 

[Yellotang]

I could probable name off at least 150. PM me if you want a good list.

 

[naesco]

What about Mary and Steve!
We should be supporting them because they make efforts to avoid the Philippine and Indonesian crap.

 

[clarionreef]

Out of a hundred customers of ours...
...only a half dozen, if that buy based on the eco-thing.
The eco-thing is 'our thing' and if customers like it...great! If they don't, we still have to pay the rent. So...we learn not to lead with the ethics-eco-do the right thing pitch as it alienates the customer base. Not in deed but in action.
They have drummed it into our heads.
They want full variety...[ including and especially cyanide caught species]
as cheap as possible ...
and also in perfect condition...
all the time.
Wether the fish were collected with nets has rarely ever been a consideration in the top concerns.
This 'movement' if you will was conceived by business people in '83 [ albiet a minority of them] and it has been but a few commercial people trying to educate NGOs and hobbyists to no avail..
Here is one case of an industry blowing the whistle on itself...and of hobbyists and NGOs complicit in the coverup and maintenance of the status quo. Shocking actually.
Money grubbing NGOs and hobbyists have ruined the chances for serious reform for a long time.
WE ARE BUSY THIS WEEK BECAUSE WE HAVE CLEANER SHRIMP IN AND A GOOD VARIETY OF GOBIES, BLENNIES AND CLOWNS. Not because we also have netcaught angels in stock.
Steve

 

[JennM]

What about Mary and Steve!
We should be supporting them because they make efforts to avoid the Philippine and Indonesian crap.

Have you ever seen Mary or Steve's stocklists, Wayne?

If you did, you'd know that either and/or both do carry Phillippine and/or Indo fish in their offerings.

The difference is, they order from reputable sources.

They avoid the CRAP yes... avoid PI and Indo? No.

There's a difference.

Jenn

 

[naesco]

What about Mary and Steve!
We should be supporting them because they make efforts to avoid the Philippine and Indonesian crap.

Have you ever seen Mary or Steve's stocklists, Wayne?

If you did, you'd know that either and/or both do carry Phillippine and/or Indo fish in their offerings.

The difference is, they order from reputable sources.

They avoid the CRAP yes... avoid PI and Indo? No.

There's a difference.

Jenn you really need to read my posts.
I read Mary's site often and I think you will agree with my post when I stated. "They make efforts to avoid the Philippine and Indonesian cyanide crap
Jenn

They both clearly are dead against the use of cyanide contribute to this board and thus deserve to be on the top of everyones list. That is why I posted in this thread.

 

[Anonymous]

i think that there's a 'critical mass' a growing store reaches that necessitate it deal w/more and more suppliers, as its turnover increases

the larger independents i worked at had at least 3-4 'major' suppliers they worked with, as well as 'fill-ins', for both sw, and fw

all suppliers are short, or over, stocked, on different things at different times-having a larger supply base makes a lot of sense, imo

 

[Terra Ferma]

My votes goes to Golden Generations and Dynasty.

 

[JennM]

What about Mary and Steve!
We should be supporting them because they make efforts to avoid the Philippine and Indonesian crap.

Have you ever seen Mary or Steve's stocklists, Wayne?

If you did, you'd know that either and/or both do carry Phillippine and/or Indo fish in their offerings.

The difference is, they order from reputable sources.

They avoid the CRAP yes... avoid PI and Indo? No.

There's a difference.

Jenn you really need to read my posts.
I read Mary's site often and I think you will agree with my post when I stated. "They make efforts to avoid the Philippine and Indonesian cyanide crap
Jenn

They both clearly are dead against the use of cyanide contribute to this board and thus deserve to be on the top of everyones list. That is why I posted in this thread.

Well I just wanted to clarify, Wayne, because in my interpretation your post implied that Steve and Mary do not buy anything at all from PI or Indo, and that is not the case.

I also asked if you've ever seen any of their stock lists? Have you? Enquiring minds want to know.

Another reason I emphasize this, is because if you ask ANY wholesaler, they will emphatically insist that they ONLY carry net-caught fishes. Nobody will admit that they carry cyanide fish. After all, that would be illegal, immoral and probably fattening.

The difference is that Steve and Mary have done all their homework.

Also FYI, Mary doesn't claim "net caught only" from PI, but she does specify the origins of fishes from net caught countries, and distinguishes the PI fish.

Steve's list specifies that he carries net caught only, no mixing with cyanide. He also doesn't carry obligate corallivore butterflies, and specifies that.

Of course, having seen those lists, you'd know that

Jenn

 

[naesco]

What about Mary and Steve!
We should be supporting them because they make efforts to avoid the Philippine and Indonesian crap.

Have you ever seen Mary or Steve's stocklists, Wayne?

If you did, you'd know that either and/or both do carry Phillippine and/or Indo fish in their offerings.

The difference is, they order from reputable sources.

They avoid the CRAP yes... avoid PI and Indo? No.

There's a difference.

Jenn you really need to read my posts.
I read Mary's site often and I think you will agree with my post when I stated. "They make efforts to avoid the Philippine and Indonesian cyanide crap
Jenn

They both clearly are dead against the use of cyanide contribute to this board and thus deserve to be on the top of everyones list. That is why I posted in this thread.

Well I just wanted to clarify, Wayne, because in my interpretation your post implied that Steve and Mary do not buy anything at all from PI or Indo, and that is not the case.

I also asked if you've ever seen any of their stock lists? Have you? Enquiring minds want to know.

Another reason I emphasize this, is because if you ask ANY wholesaler, they will emphatically insist that they ONLY carry net-caught fishes. Nobody will admit that they carry cyanide fish. After all, that would be illegal, immoral and probably fattening.

The difference is that Steve and Mary have done all their homework.

Also FYI, Mary doesn't claim "net caught only" from PI, but she does specify the origins of fishes from net caught countries, and distinguishes the PI fish.

Steve's list specifies that he carries net caught only, no mixing with cyanide. He also doesn't carry obligate corallivore butterflies, and specifies that.

Of course, having seen those lists, you'd know that

Jenn

Jenn (my earlier post

I read Mary's site often

 

[Anonymous]

My votes goes to Golden Generations and Dynasty.

8O 8O 8O 8O 8O

 

[JennM]

Jenn you really need to read my posts.

Oh I read it, Wayne. I simply pointed out my interpretation of what you seemed to be saying, and wanted to point out the truth for you.

I read Mary's site often and I think you will agree with my post when I stated. "They make efforts to avoid the Philippine and Indonesian cyanide crap

Yes we know you read Mary's site. That's the main reason Mary cited for removing the wealth of information there, because of your constant misuse of it. Thanks.

They both clearly are dead against the use of cyanide contribute to this board and thus deserve to be on the top of everyones list. That is why I posted in this thread.

Have you ordered from them? What do you think of their selection and quality?


I also asked if you've ever seen any of their stock lists? Have you? Enquiring minds want to know.

How about an answer to that, Wayne? I've asked it for the third time now. I know you like to skirt questions or answer them with questions, but how about a good old fashioned "YES" or "NO"?

My POINT is... Wayne, you are not a member of the trade, so your opinion is not taken seriously by me or by many here. This is not a personal attack or a flame, but for example, if I briefed you on the finer points of real estate law, I'd be laughed off the planet because I've never been a real estate attorney. I've closed on several mortgages, but it hardly makes me an authority on what goes on.

Likewise, you are constantly telling us, the members of the marine ornamentals industry, how our job should be done. Forgive me if I don't take all your advise to heart, since you don't work in the industry, and to my knowledge you don't even own an aquarium.

Do you own a working saltwater aquarium, Wayne?

I can more readily accept advise from people who at least participate in the hobby, even if they don't have a clue how the industry works. Most hobbyists figure the fish just appear in the LFS tanks, without a second thought to how they got there.

Today I'm asking if you've seen Mary or Steve's lists because your initial post implies that they don't buy from PI or Indo... NOT SO. If you ARE involved in the trade and haven't seen their lists, then you aren't taking your own advise (does your family member's employer buy from Mary or Steve?), and if you aren't in the trade, then naturally you haven't seen their lists.

"Lends to credibility, Your Honour" (to borrow from the legal profession.)

OK I'm off to the airport to pick up an order of goodies from Steve. I look forward to some direct answers

Jenn

 

[Anonymous]

Wayne, we get Indo and PI almost every week. True, it's not that "typical cyanide garbage".

Can you PLEASE answer Jenn's couple of questions Wayne? We'd truly like to know of your current involvement in the trade, other the reeForm.

 

[clarionreef]

Guys,
None of the big professional ie. salaried NGO reformers keep fish either.
Why should an amatuer one then have to keep em?
Out of touch, unworkable notions come from lack of experience in the leadership...Its like a rule or something.
Steve

 

[naesco]

Marillon asked

Also, whom are the top 5-10 wholesalers out there?

I replied

What about Mary and Steve!
We should be supporting them because they make efforts to avoid the Philippine and Indonesian crap.

None of you chose to acknowledge that.
This thread has nothing to do with my tanks, my son or Mary's reasons for modifying her website from time to time.
Who do you think you are? US forces Iraqi prison guards?

 

[JennM]

Again with evasiveness, Wayne.

Chip asked who the top 5-10 were, but he didn't specify ...

Top quality?

Top volume?

Top in popularity?

Top in the alphabetical list?

Perhaps Chip can clarify what he meant, but you jumped in with the PI/Indo crap statement, which could have been interpreted several different ways. I simply pointed out that the way *I* interpreted it, was not true, and I posted the FACTS based on my firsthand knowledge. Now I am asking for yours.

Again, I ask... 4th time now... Wayne, have you EVER seen one of Mary's or Steve's stock lists?

-and-

Do you keep marine ornamental fishes and/or corals?

Since you were fast to assert that Steve and Mary are tops, you MUST have some frame of reference. I'd bet if Big Box Fish R Us was a regular contributor and gave the doublespeak, you'd endorse them too, whether or not you'd ever seen their lists, or better yet, a shipment or two of their fish. So I feel that since you decided to chime into this thread, my questions are relevant and justified.

I do choose to acknowlege that Mary and Steve should be supported - I put my money where my mouth is, and I support both of them.

I anxiously await your answers