Fish Mortality In Trade

[clarionreef]

Wayne,
Why not istruct the innocent masses of duped consumers to buy...a book on fish care? This would help avoid the cospiracy to keep them in the dark about everything....especially deep dark secrets regarding tang care.
Steve
PS.
BoOKS...the hardest thing to get in the hands of consumers these days.
No...its not from book burnings...its from lack of interest in care and husbandry in the flash and dash consumer driven culture...in North America.

 

[clarionreef]

Is Kuiter and Debelius' Surgeonfishes and Rabbitfishes so hard to find.
Every trade show has em on the tables.
Now theres even a 'Idiots guide to Saltwater aquariums' out.
Then theres every thing down to finray counts and scale counts and stomache analysis reports on internet sites ad infinitum...and Scott Michaels website, and Wet web Media and................................................................so on and so on.
Knowing what tangs [ and green iguanas] eat and dont eat and what space requirements they have is hardly a state secret.
Thinking that a purchase gives you a right to remain ignorant is cruel and irresponsible. Care sheets are cheat sheets for begginers and hardly enough. The challenge only begins with the purchase and should've begun prior.
Steve.
Helpless, useless, whining consumers kept in the dark about things by unscrupulous dealers? Give me a break.
What forum are we on now?
Play with your mouse and pull up 500 pages before lunchtime if you like.
Still missing some information? Like what? Thats when you come on line and ask someone else....easy, open and the very free-est of speech.
Steve

 

[Anonymous]

Looks like USCOP isn't gonna get the 4 billion they asked for. With out that, what regulation you talking about Wayne?

 

[clarionreef]

THEY WILL COME AND THEY WILL BUY..."
No they won't.
Glossing over the real point and changing the subject to something so far less significant was kind shady there Wayne.
You cannot win even 3 allies here after 2 years....where will the new revolution of consciouceness come from to drive the demand for sustainable practice and harvest ethics?
Irresponsibility exists at all levels and nationalities and trying to pin it all on one country and one level in the chain smacks of insinserity.
Steve

 

[naesco]

Looks like USCOP isn't gonna get the 4 billion they asked for. With out that, what regulation you talking about Wayne?

I heard it was still a go. Am I wrong?


Steve

Industry at all levels and in all countries but especially those that deal in or with the Philippines or Indonesia are responsible not the innocent hobbyists that could never image that the fish they bought was caught with a deadly poison.

Dr. Rubec posted an excellent study. My first post indicated that industry would ignore the content of this thread and that is exacted what they have done.

Where are the recommendations to improve the DOA rates?
If the problem is only in the west, what are the solutions to the problem of unacceptable DOA rates in the east?

Lets have some concrete answers instead of denial and blah blah blah!!

]

 

[Anonymous]

If the problem is only in the west, what are the solutions to the problem of unacceptable DOA rates in the east?

Huh :lol:

Ah, Wayne, reread the thread, the problem ISN'T in the west We don't have those problems Peter is citing, it's only a few (the ones he sampled). If you only sample a few bad apples, what do YOU think the outcome would be? If I sampled felons and asked them if they ever committed a crime, the outcome would be what?

I do have an answer, no MO shipments from the Pacific should travel past California Problem solved Wayne. It's no wonder so many fish die, when they have to travel yet another 5k miles, thru non tropical weather on top of the 16+ hour flight.

Wow guys, Wayne samples like Peter. Now the few who post in this forum, ARE THE INDUSTRY!

And, YES, your wrong. USCOP was asking for 4 billion dollars. Bush wants 80 billion more for Iraq, thats were that 4 billion is ear marked for You really haven't been following Bush and his activities, have you? He's not to into the environment, he's more into big business. House Resources Committee Chairman Richard Pombo, a republican from central California, doesn't think it'll happen, and he's in charge of financing USCOP

 

[naesco]

Looks like USCOP isn't gonna get the 4 billion they asked for. With out that, what regulation you talking about Wayne?

I heard it was still a go. Am I wrong?


Steve

Industry at all levels and in all countries but especially those that deal in or with the Philippines or Indonesia are responsible not the innocent hobbyists that could never image that the fish they bought was caught with a deadly poison.

Dr. Rubec posted an excellent study. My first post indicated that industry would ignore the content of this thread and that is exacted what they have done.

Where are the recommendations to improve the DOA rates?
If the problem is only in the east, what are the solutions to the problem of unacceptable DOA rates in the east?

Lets have some concrete answers instead of denial and blah blah blah!!

]

 

[naesco]

If the problem is only in the west, what are the solutions to the problem of unacceptable DOA rates in the east?

Huh :lol:

Ah, Wayne, reread the thread, the problem ISN'T in the west We don't have those problems Peter is citing, it's only a few (the ones he sampled). If you only sample a few bad apples, what do YOU think the outcome would be? If I sampled felons and asked them if they ever committed a crime, the outcome would be what?

I do have an answer, no MO shipments from the Pacific should travel past California Problem solved Wayne. It's no wonder so many fish die, when they have to travel yet another 5k miles, thru non tropical weather on top of the 16+ hour flight.

Wow guys, Wayne samples like Peter. Now the few who post in this forum, ARE THE INDUSTRY!

And, YES, your wrong. USCOP was asking for 4 billion dollars. Bush wants 80 billion more for Iraq, thats were that 4 billion is ear marked for You really haven't been following Bush and his activities, have you? He's not to into the environment, he's more into big business. House Resources Committee Chairman Richard Pombo, a republican from central California, doesn't think it'll happen, and he's in charge of financing USCOP

the east the east! what are the solutions?
Bush is not going to approve 4 billion to stop the carnage and is going to spend 80 billion on more carnage! STOP HIM Get in the streets, protest

 

[clarionreef]

Gresham,
Do you know what carnage he's talking about?
Could it be last nites 1/2 tea-cup of DOAs from those 25 boxes?
Wayne,
I hate to tell you this but the notion of 'carnage' suggests a loss of frieght and invoice outlay and is therefore unacceptable.
Could you imagine pouring money down a rathole of carnage oblivious to the losses? Do you think us unwise? How bout oblivious?
That would kill us middleclass wholesalers in a few months. Its simple math actually. Only rich dealers could burn their capital like that...or afford to be incompetent...but why?
The issue here for me is the psychological need in some to embellish injustice, inequity and wrongs to show that they care in excess.
The "I care more then you thing" is a character anamolie among us 'Greenies'and does harm to the real issues as it scares away 95% of the would-be supporters of legitimate grievance.


Steve
PS A college poll was just released that showed many/most college students no longer consider racsim an issue or a significant part of their lives. It has angered some of us old guard liberals as we were trained to expect injustice as part of the landscape. The fact that many kids don't feel victims anymore actually is a wonderful trend...and cause for re-evaluation of old dogmas.

The issues concerning the environment need a more scientific focus and less of an appearance of public self therapy session.

 

[Kalkbreath]

Bush is not going to approve 4 billion to stop the carnage and is going to spend 80 billion on more carnage! STOP HIM Get in the streets, protest

Im much more concerned with whats going to happen in the middle east when a country like Iran runs out of oil and has nothing left but radio active toys to launch in spite.,then I am the trade.

If Sadam had had a flashing red button to push during his last minutes hiding in his hole in the ground .......you know he would have pushed it. and it now looks like he had the oil for food money and smuggling ability to purchase more then one of those toys he has had his eye on for decades.
The religious leaders of countries like Iran want to be able to push flashing red buttons as well.....Do you really think that when they run out of oil to sell ,become broke {it will happen one day} and have zero to fall back on , that the leaders in control of the red buttons wont launch in spite? There already blowing children up in the name of ****

If our generation does not subdue certain quests for WMDs .......world wide .
Our children will have their own RTN to deal with.

 

[Douglas S Lehman]

Hello GreshamH
In your sample of felons I think you would get the same responce from the LFS, were all innocent and we do NOT sell juiced fish. That I learned at Sing Sing.

 

[dizzy]

What were you in for?

 

[mkirda]

So what is wrong with outing the truth? Why are you and others in industry afraid of someone using these papers to let the world know that there is a much better way of handling this industy/hobby than what is presently going on.

Naesco,

Did you read the paper?
All Peter did was a literature review - Which in turn suggests avenues for further research.
NO RESEARCH HAS EVER BEEN PUBLISHED on the use of these chemicals for marine fish because no experiments have ever been done.

Funny, isn't it? The fact that there is no truth?
How do you out something that hasn't been done?
Why be afraid of quoting something that has never been written?

Bang up job on the paper, Peter.
Hoping that it will spur on some real basic research here.

Regards.
Mike Kirda

 

[naesco]

So what is wrong with outing the truth? Why are you and others in industry afraid of someone using these papers to let the world know that there is a much better way of handling this industy/hobby than what is presently going on.

Naesco,

Did you read the paper?
All Peter did was a literature review - Which in turn suggests avenues for further research.
NO RESEARCH HAS EVER BEEN PUBLISHED on the use of these chemicals for marine fish because no experiments have ever been done.

Funny, isn't it? The fact that there is no truth?
How do you out something that hasn't been done?
Why be afraid of quoting something that has never been written?

Bang up job on the paper, Peter.
Hoping that it will spur on some real basic research here.

Regards.
Mike Kirda

Do you have some solutions to put forward, Mike?

 

[mkirda]

Do you have some solutions to put forward, Mike?

Sure.
Do some basic freaking research.
See what come from that, then implement what works and eliminate what doesn't.

We're actually lucky in that this research is likely to get published.
If it were company-sponsored, it would become a 'trade secret'.