help with plumbing and pump selection

[thetman36]

I need some help with my 210 gal reef tank build (plumbing and pump selection) the tank is 30" tall and sits on a 36 inch stand. I have dual overflows. I am going to use 4X 1" durso stand pipes so there will be 4 1" pipes leading down to the sump. I am going to plumb the return with 1 1/2" pvc splitting at 4 tees into 1" pvc running up the back side of the tank and up over the top for my returns. So i will have 4 X1" returns coming over the top back into the tank. the tank is 6 feet in length. each return pipe will have 2 elbows on them at the top so they will sit on the top edge of the tank and will end with 3/4 inch lock line. how do i figure my max head. and if I want at least 5 times turn over flow how do i pick out my return pump. I was thinking of an iwaki 100 pressure rated pump. the sump is 48"X18"X18" and I will be using an external skimmer powered by an iwaki 70. To sum it up each return will be 6 feet high and end in two right angles.

 

[House of Laughter]

Head pressure calculator should help you out

http://www.your-garden-ponds-center.com/head-pressure-calculator.html

Sounds like you have 8 90's, 20-25 feet or hosing, 5-7 fittings. The vertical height is where it gets tricky since the total vertical height in all your runs does not equal one run of the total height (4 runs of 5 feet doesn't equate to 1 run of 20ft of head pressure).

5x turn over sounds like you don't want a ton of return as your primary flow.

Head pressure increases in a mathematical formula that can be found on engineering sights if you really want to understand it.

As a recommendation, a 4ft tank really doesn't need 4 1" returns for flow in my opinion (unless you really want to pack it in with SPS which could take years to grow) OR you aren't using any internal flow (MP40's or the like).

I would go with the following unless the tank is already drilled:

2 - 1" returns with 3/4 Locline exits - if you really want, put 3
1 - 1.5" drain (or 2 if you really want a lot of turn over).

With a decent pressure rated pump, you could pump 2000 gph through a 1.5" drain.

Hope that helps,

House

 

[thetman36]

thank you for your help I am using an MP40 and MP60 to move water around in the tank. it is a 6 foot tank not 4 feet that is why i was going to use 4 returns. i think a pressure rated external pump at 2000 gal per hour should work fine.

 

[Ziggy]

I need some help with my 210 gal reef tank build (plumbing and pump selection) the tank is 30" tall and sits on a 36 inch stand. I have dual overflows. I am going to use 4X 1" durso stand pipes so there will be 4 1" pipes leading down to the sump. I am going to plumb the return with 1 1/2" pvc splitting at 4 tees into 1" pvc running up the back side of the tank and up over the top for my returns. So i will have 4 X1" returns coming over the top back into the tank. the tank is 6 feet in length. each return pipe will have 2 elbows on them at the top so they will sit on the top edge of the tank and will end with 3/4 inch lock line. how do i figure my max head. and if I want at least 5 times turn over flow how do i pick out my return pump. I was thinking of an iwaki 100 pressure rated pump. the sump is 48"X18"X18" and I will be using an external skimmer powered by an iwaki 70. To sum it up each return will be 6 feet high and end in two right angles.

Why not using 2x durso for drain and 2x return? Usually RR tank has two holes in each overflow box one for drain and other one for return.

 

[thetman36]

dual overflow

yes it has the two holes in each overflow but i figure if i can get more water coming out into the sump then my turnover rate will be much higher. I know lots of people are doing these all in one sumps with low flow refugiums. But I want to have a higher turnover rate through my sump and run a refugium separate from the sump. So the refugium can do it's thing nice and slow but i can have a very high turnover rate. So by using all 4 holes to go down into the sump i will run 4 returns over the back have a high recycle rate and still run a slow refugium off to the side fed by a second pump. what are your thoughts on this. I have lots of room for sump refug and even a quarantine tank.

 

[rkaragozler]

are you sure that the holes inside the overflows are all 1" bulkheads (4 pieces). from all the tanks that i have seen they have 2-1", and 2-3/4" bulkheads.
here is a drain chart that was created from a member on another site. hope it helps. just keep in mind that these numbers are for a full drain down, without any restrictions. determine exactly what your bulkhead sizes are, and cross reference them, also keep in mind trying to drain over 2000 gph is going to sound very load.

 

[thetman36]

That is a great chart. Yes matter of fact all 4 one inch bulkheads are in along with the 4X 1 inch dursos
So yup 4 1 inch. Other people said the same thing about the different size holes but these are all the same size.

 

[rkaragozler]

okay, to be on the safe side we say that a 1" drain will handle 600pgh, so for you that would be 2400 gph, now in your case what I would do is take 1 of the drains and reduce it to 3/4" and run it into the separate fuge and throttle your flow, this way you don't loose any pressure from the Iwaki.
as far as plumbing the Iwaki and using 4 returns, what i would do is run 1 1" pvc from the corner of the tank and then run 1 1" pvc along the top of the tank, from their you T off using 1x1x3/4" T's (threaded on the 3/4"). use a lockline flow valve and then your lockline and nozzles. depending on the location of your return pump and how many coupling, elbows, unions you use will determine your gph, if you do the math, than you can figure out if that pump is sufficient.

 

[thetman36]

I had not even though about how to plumb the fuge that is a great idea! if I keep the fuge higher than the sump I can let gravity feed it in on one side and out the other with the same size drain as the one coming in from the DT. you have given me food for though on this for sure. As far as noise I was going to run two of the drains from the DT into each other one from the left overflow and one from the right overflow if I make them crash into each other then end in a right angle elbow then down to the sump it should slow it down and help with the noise. I would do the same with the other two drains. I guess I would need a bigger diameter pipe after the two run together? or am i mistaken. I was also going to have the drain end inside the sump below the water level to help with noise. If i am going to run filter socks I may have to rig something with unions so it can be taken apart to clean out the socks (being that the drain will end down into the socks under water) Good place for a true union ball valve perhaps?

 

[rkaragozler]

you mean 3 drains going into 1, that is possible you would have to use a 2" pvc. as far as elbows i would try to use as many 45 degrees as I can. and if you are going to submerge the pvc into the sump you have to create air holes so you don't get the "toilet flushing" sound. You can do this to the ends of the pvc.

 

[thetman36]

great thanks i will try the holes for sure. can i use a Y joint coming off one of the drains to feed the fuge and have the other end of the Y continue on to meet the other drains? or is a dedicated drain needed for the fuge.

 

[rkaragozler]

yes you can t off one of the lines to feed the fuge you don't have to dedicate 1, but since you have 4 drains why would you? imo, trying to push that much flow thru a sump is asking for problems, but this is just my opinion.

 

[thetman36]

ok that is what i was thinking thanks again for all your help. I will send you picks when the plumbing is done!

 

[thetman36]

i ordered the Iwaki md 100 will be here in a week so i have some time yet to plan this out