Starting a 20 gallon long saltwater aquarium tank

[oro50]

I have started the cycling of a new tank. So far my tank has started cycling for three weeks.
Today, the water was tested. The ammonia level was around .25 and there was a nitrite reading, which was very low.

However these readings were taken roughly less than 24 hours after some ammonia I added to the tank.

My question is this, when the test was conducted, my tank has 10lbs of cured live rock for a 20 gallon aquarium. However this test was also done, after I did a 50% water change, as I read online somewhere that when you felt your tank was cycled you were suppose to do a water change.
Anyway so the guy who tested my water said I should wait at least another week.
During the night now I made a few changes. I added more live nitrifying bacteria to the tank as well as five more pounds of cured live rock.

My salinity is 1.024. My main question is that I have two filters right now as well, that have been running for the last three weeks on it. One is a fluval 106 canister filter as well as a aquaclear hang on the back filter? Is there some other filter system I should be using or are these sufficient when I bring in a fish into the aquarium

I also have live argonite sand. Lastly, yes I have been doing a fishless cycle. I have been using pure ammonia as a catalyst.
My heater has the water at 82 degrees.

Any suggestions on should I still continue to add (now a bit more I guess because of the added live rock and live nitrifying bacteria) ammonia every day or every other day, until my tests and the tests I have done by aquarium store employees tell me that my ammonia nitrites are 0 and my nitrates are at or less than 20 ppm?

Lastly if I have already been doing this for the last three weeks any ideas how much longer this might take to cycle the tank completely?

 

[Cu455]

If you want you can add a protein skimmer. It will help you maintain better water quality but you don't need it. What kind of media are you using in the filters?

When you are not showing ammonia or nitrites wait a couple of days and then you can start adding fish. You can probably keep your temp at 82 but I would drop it to 79 or 80.

 

[oro50]

I have the temperature set to around a bit below 80, but it looks like the thermometer likes to sit around 82 degrees.
I noticed that the heater unit's heat signature glow didn't turn back on, (indicating that the temperature needed to change again) after I made the slight adjustment.

 

[oro50]

The heater I'm using is 50 watts

 

[ReefWreak]

How long have you been dosing ammonia? The cycle hasn't really started until there was an ammonia input running the cycle.

I would really only give it one or two kicks of ammonia. Small enough that you can see it in a test (you said you saw 0.25ppm already), then I'd stop adding it. Wait to see that ammonia turn to nitrite (or just skip it), then wait to see it turn to nitrate.

Once you're reading nitrate, the cycle is complete, and there are nitrifying bacteria in your tank. Once the ammonia and nitrite are gone, you can start SLOWLY adding in life (preferably with hardier species first).

As for filtration, depends on what you want to keep long term. Is this going to be a fish-only-with-liverock tank (FOWLR)? Is it going to be a reef?

If a reef, you probably won't want either the canister or Hang-on Back (HOB) filter long term, as if you don't change them every day or two, they'll collect particles that will increase nitrates.

For reference, I'm currently cycling my 29g biocube that I'm planning on turning into a reef tank. The rocks I bought were in a bucket and were wet, and only out of the tank for a month. They were pretty bare, so there wasn't much external die-off to cycle. I added some pellet food to the tank (a small pinch) 2 weeks ago, and I'm already detecting nitrates, with no ammonia or nitrite. I have a skimmer on the tank, but short of aerating the water, it's not doing anything.

I think this week I'll do a major water change to get rid of the 20-30ppm nitrates I'm seeing, and will siphon the sandbed and rear chambers to get any detritus that floated around when installing the tank, since those eventually lead to nitrate issues long term.

Small tanks are really hard, and I think the best filtration for them is weekly or bi-weekly water changes of large volumes of water (25%-50%) with siphoning the sand once a month. You can keep the HOB filter and put some GFO in it (Phosban, RowaPhos, Phoslock, etc) if you start to get an algae problem, maybe some carbon if you're seeing yellowing in the water, and maybe some filter floss to get particulates out, but that's about it. I guess you can put them in either the HOB or canister, but external filters are always a pain if you don't necessarily need it.

Anyways, hope that helps!

 

[oro50]

Yes I just wanted one fish. However maybe like 2 corals.

 

[oro50]

I've probably been dosing ammonia for about 3 weeks.
With this said, I added 5lbs of cured live rock last night as well as the entire contents of one nitrifying bacteria bottle meant for 40 gallons I think into the tank last night. Then I added a bit more ammonia then I normally did.
With this said over the course of the week I intend to take new test readings, and generally see as I add some ammonia every other day or every day if the ammonia nitrite and nitrate readings start to go down gradually?

 

[oro50]

Correction I have for 3 weeks. This monday is the formation of the fourth week so far now that I have started the cycling process.
I also have live argonite sand as a substrate.

 

[ReefWreak]

I would stop adding ammonia. I've never started a cycle that way, maybe someone else has better advice around that, but I wouldn't keep adding it continuously.

Now you should wait and keep testing ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate, and once all of the ammonia and nitrite are gone, then you'll see your nitrate rise, and then you'll know the cycle is done. Then it's time for water changes to reduce the nitrate levels down.

That is when you can add your fish. Remember that if you're considering adding multiple fishes, be sure to put the most docile one in first.

Have you been following any threads on ReefCentral or anything for a primer on using ammonia to cycle your tank? I'd be interested to learn more.

 

[oro50]

Whatever else I was going to add, was going to be at minimal doses, and only after every 24 hours or every 48 hours. I was going to do so, because I had read that if you didn't while the cycling process was going on, the bacteria in the tank that eats ammonia and converts what it doesn't use for energy as a byproduct, called nitrite would then die, as what it uses for food for energy would be gone after every 24 hours?

 

[oro50]

Since as I read once a fish is in there, the need for ammonia doses at general intervals is gone, since the fish is providing it at a regular rate for fish?

 

[oro50]

again I just plan to have 1 red maroon with gold stripes clownfish? Yet I want to get a juvenile which I believe starts out with white stripes?

 

[oro50]

Since I also want corals at some point if I can do it, I was wondering since I already have a aqueon deluxe hood, can I just get a new special light for corals to replace the bulb it came with? My hood is 30". If not, do I actually have to remove that hood and actually purchase a special lighting system that would go over the tank?
I saw at Manhattan aquariums that they actually drilled holes in the roof and used suspension wire of some kind to hold their lights. I can't do that where my aquarium is?
So I'm wondering, two things. Without a hood, wouldn't a fish like to jump?
Secondly, if I had to remove the hood for some reason, can I eventually get some sort of light for corals that hangs on the tank?

 

[oro50]

So after adding my last dose of pure ammonia so far in this tank, well about 36 hours after the fact, I did a ammonia test.
Wow it went through the roof. I think it's even higher than the largest reading I can obtain through my test kit, which is 8.0 ppm?
So now should I just wait it out for the bacteria colonies on my cured live rock to eat it up completely?
Should I just completely stop adding even a little bit of pure ammonia to the tank, until another test in the future indicates that there is 0 ammonia?
Am I hurting the bacteria in anyway that I am trying to promote to develop, by adding too much ammonia this last time?

 

[ReefWreak]

First thing with a test result that high, is that you should retest and double-check that you're doing everything by the book.

If that is true, then stop dosing ammonia, and test ammonia every 24 hours and see if it is going down. In theory, too much ammonia will nuke the bacteria. I'm not sure what amount that will be, but that's one of the reasons that cycling with ammonia is dangerous.

If it doesn't go down, you may have to re-seed the tank (see if you can get a handful of sand or a small rock from someone). When it does go down, then you'll be fine, just look to see how long it takes to go down. I recall seeing somewhere that if you can reduce 1ppm of ammonia in 24 hours, it's considered cycled.

My benchmark is that if you are adding ammonia through some process, and are testing nitrate out the other end, then you've developed a cycle.

I guess best bet is just test every 24 hours. If you see the ammonia levels going down, then you have a cycle going.


For your other post, yes, fish jump. People put a screen over the top of their tanks to prevent it. I didn't do that, and never had any jumpers, but it depends on which fishes you have too.

You will likely not be able to grow any corals under the aqueon hood. Maybe some mushrooms or xenia or something, but it's not likely. You can add any number of lighting setups over the top of your tank. That's when things get crazy. Metal halide, T5, LED, lots of options.

For now, survive the cycle, do water changes, read and learn as it's cycling.

 

[oro50]

Yeah as of now I won't add any more in.
I will test every 24 hours.
I do have a question about the nuke part? If that was true, than shouldn't all the bacteria colonies on my cured live rocks have shown distinct signs of dying off already? Yet they are still there?
Again I tested for nitrites too. The test was high 5ppm. Doesn't that indicate the bacteria already converted at least some of the ammonia into the less toxic form of nitrite, which will eventually promote the type of bacteria to grow that eats nitrite?
The main issue with not having a hood, is one I paid for it, and I hate to think I wasted money, yet at the same time, if I had to remove the hood, yes I don't want my fish to jump and commit suicide.
The fish I am getting is a red maroon clownfish with gold stripes. This is the one I want. Just one fish for now.

 

[ReefWreak]

You can't see any of the bacteria in or on your rock. They are too small, and only when you have VERY LARGE problematic growths of them (i.e. cyanobacteria or dinoflagellates) do you see bacteria colonies.

Its possible if not likely that you still have plenty of bacteria. Actually nuking the tank is pretty unlikely and probably hard to do, but again I've never started a tank with pure ammonia additions.

For a while, while you only have that one clown, you can leave the hood on. You can even add some mushroom corals and see if the hood itself creates enough light for the mushrooms to survive and maybe thrive. They might be fine, and since mushrooms are related to anemones, it's possible that a clown will host it as well. Might be a good anemone alternative since you can't have one in a tank that small.

Just be sure to not add anything until the ammonia and nitrite are at 0.

 

[ReefWreak]

No longer replying as this is a cross post to here

 

[oro50]

To answer the question posed by ReefWreak

I plan to add a juvenile red maroon clownfish.


Just one.

I am aware this species is territorial and aggressive.

It's ok I plan on owning just one fish.

 

[ReefWreak]

WHY DO YOU KEEP OPENING NEW THREADS?!!?!

at least put in a link to prior ones!