• Why not take a moment to introduce yourself to our members?

Ghosty

Reefer
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
TangGirl

I just read in another thread you stated that canister filters and wet/dry filters are not the best filtration for reef systems. What are good filters? I am still in the planning phases for my tank.

I have a 58G, will have MH/VHO and plan on having a reef tank.

Thanks! :D
 

hdtran

Advanced Reefer
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I'm not TG, but if you read the new reefkeeper's FAQ in the reefs.org library, and Bob Fenner's "Conscientious Marine Aquarist" and/or "Reef Invertebrates" (w/ Anthony Calfo) or John Tullock's "Your First Saltwater Aquarium" or "Natural Reef Aquariums," you will see that the primary recommendation is to use live rock (or live rock together with live sand) as your primary biological filtration, combined with a protein skimmer (a.k.a. foam fractionator).
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Actually, I would say that Antoine & Bob would offer that a large, healthy refugium would be the best method, and that with such (once well-established) one could forego the skimmer entirely.
 

hdtran

Advanced Reefer
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Seamaiden,

Don't you mean "algae scrubber" rather than "refugium" in order to keep the vocabulary police happy?

I agree that the apparatus popularly known as a refugium is an excellent nutrient exporter.

(not TG)
 

Ghosty

Reefer
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
HD et al

Thanks for the reply. Roger on the live rock. I had that in my last set up and loved it. I recently bought Fenner's and Calfo's book plus one more. I am starting to read and sift through the information but I thought I would ask everyone's opinion here. I am trying to do my own research though.....

So thanks for your thoughts and input!

BTW -- as far as vocabulary police go: What is the difference between a sump and a wet/dry? I am trying to plan for a sump and would like to add a refugium/algae scrubber -- but space is an issue.
 

hdtran

Advanced Reefer
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
A sump is an auxiliary container, usually underneath the main display tank. All your unsightly equipment, should you wish to do so, go into your sump. (E.g. heater & protein skimmer).

A wet/dry is a specific type of nitrogen-fixing filter that involves trickling water over biological media, mixed with air (hence, wet & dry). You can build up extremely efficient bacterial colonies in such filters, who (which? Grammar police, help!) will happily instantly convert ammonia waste to nitrite, and nitrite to nitrate. Hence, the popular theory that 'wet/dry filters can become nitrate factories.'

You can usually partition a sump to include an algae scrubber. You generally want these to have lower flow rates than your tank circulation.
 

NaCl-H2O

Experienced Reefer
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Maybe we need to come up with a new word or acronym that discribes the refugium as used by so many in duel fuctionality mode as an algae scrubber and refugium. This would help with some of the confusion with those new to the hobby and keep the vocabulary police at bay. More & more people are using this type of setup and there is no replacing the advantages of using a larg refugium full of macro-algae in ones system so we need to get the gurus on it. We need 3 words: Algae scubber, Refugium and ?????? for one apperatus that does both.
How does refuscrubber sound :)
or maybe algafuguim 8O
what about RAS = Refugium Algae Scrubber -> yet another abbreviation for the hobby. :wink:
Well I'm sure something will come along sooner or later. :D
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Hmm.. I can't say what we should do about the term "refugia" (or even that we should), but I can tell you, Mr. Tran, that the grammar police (much to my surprise) will actually allow you to apply the word "who" even to entirely inanimate objects! 8O (Imagine my surprise)
However, that being said, if using the word "which", it must usually be preceded by a comma "," except in the event of beginning a sentence or question. :mrgreen:

In my own opinion, I prefer "refugium" to be a more all-encompassing word, as "algae scrubber", to me at least, means a series of trays in which macroalgae are/is grown (see Antoine's feelings on mixing of macros, plus, he doesn't really like Caulerpa species, whereas I've had fabulous luck with them, but we've had that discussion already) alone - key word here being "solely" - sans sand, live rock, or other features that would lend a "refugia" feel to the set up (holdfasts and other means by which said algae may afix itself to any substrata notwithstanding).TM
(Whew! Talk about a run-on sentence! Oh! Mrs. Dupres, she must be rolling over in her grave!)

Also, a refugium may or may not require a great deal of supplemental lighting (especially if a total lack of macroalgae is um.. present), whereas by its very nature an algal scrubber would have a very real need for specific lighting.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
is an algea scrubber just a always lit section where water passes through that has algae all over the place?
 

NaCl-H2O

Experienced Reefer
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Supaboy,

An algae scrubber is really any lit apparatus trough which main tank water is run separate from the main tank. Where algae is encuraged to grow with the intent to remove some of it from time to time to export/remove the nutrients that it absorbs.

The most common sold were wide flat devices with built in lights that used micro-algae instead of the macro-algae used in most refugia.

Presonally I think a larg well established, well maintained, refugia with a good light, full of caulerpa works better than the old aglae scrubbers. Your nutrients will all be 0 even with no skimmer.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Ghosty":11r8ntx6 said:
TangGirl

I just read in another thread you stated that canister filters and wet/dry filters are not the best filtration for reef systems. What are good filters? I am still in the planning phases for my tank.

I have a 58G, will have MH/VHO and plan on having a reef tank.

Thanks! :D

http://www.reefs.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=23599

http://www.reefs.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=18954

there's some background discussion :wink:


if you do a search for 'factory' you will get a whole buncha threads discussing the issue further :)

hth
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
NaCl-H2O":3hrlwxm6 said:
Supaboy,

An algae scrubber is really any lit apparatus trough which main tank water is run separate from the main tank. Where algae is encuraged to grow with the intent to remove some of it from time to time to export/remove the nutrients that it absorbs.

The most common sold were wide flat devices with built in lights that used micro-algae instead of the macro-algae used in most refugia.

Presonally I think a larg well established, well maintained, refugia with a good light, full of caulerpa works better than the old aglae scrubbers. Your nutrients will all be 0 even with no skimmer.

ok I had that going on in my sump but I never intended to remove and algea. I guess I will start doing that
 

J.Howard

Experienced Reefer
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I heard another member refer to a refugium/sump as a FUMP. Far from official, but fun and short. Unless you use microalgae or a mat type (Ulva) algae it's not a scrubber if I remember right. Who wants the hassle of an actual scrubber? I have read that they can often contribute to nuisance algae blooms if not kept on top of.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
iirc, algae scrubbers were mostly made popular due to the interpretations of walter adey, and his book,
'dynamic aquaria, building living ecosystems' (an excellent read, btw)

though it may not be built in 'classic scrubber' fashion (raceway/tray or rotating wheel), a sump/fuge w/a macroalgae culture still does 'algae scrub' the system, in a sense, and may equal it's performance in the level of 'sinking of the nutrients' via the macros

both are using algae as a nutrient sink

my main problem w/intense algae scrubbing would be with the possible large pH swings that might occur, with that much plant matter (in relation to system size)respiring at nite

i also believe that a 'true scrubber' would have to be able to support a larger amount of sq footage of turf algae than those that are typically built for the hobby :wink:
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I just use the Micro Nuisance algae that grows in my illuminated sump. I have seen a decline in algae in the main tank though
 

Sponsor Reefs

We're a FREE website, and we exist because of hobbyists like YOU who help us run this community.

Click here to sponsor $10:


Top