Hi everyone, new here! Starting a 90 gallon marine tank!

[pinchharmonic]

Considering the following refugiums for my 90 gallon reef tank. (tank will mostly have fish and live rock, but a few invertebrates).








I'm really noobie, so I'd love some suggestions on a sump/refugium. Here are some pictures. (the first two pics are the same refugium / sump from a different angle).


The first refugium (first two pics): 36"L x 16"W x 18"H -- 44 gallons capacity

From what I can see, the sump/refug in the first two pics is the more premium of the both.Correct me if i'm wrong, but this is how I see it working:

(1).The water flows in, and makes contact with the protein skimmer,

(2). then flows into the refugium part in middle where I can add some sand / algae. nitrate eaters

(3). Then the water leaves back to my tank with some bio balls around it (is that kind of weird to have bio balls at the end of your sump rather than water trickling all over the top of it?)



The Second refugium (last pic): 24"L x 12"W x 14H" -- 17.45 gallons

This is a much cheaper refugium.

(1). Water flows in and pours all over the bio balls

(2). it flows into middle where I can put sand and algae

(3). It comes out the far left to be pumped back to my tank. (Could a skimmer be put there? at the end of the sump?)



Questions:

1. I know that you want a larger refugium because it gives you more water, so therefore you have more total water in your tank to buffer against problems. is 44 gallons overkill? Is 17.45 too little?

2. Can you guys see any problems with gurgle / splash? The first one doesn't seem to have a good lid over the sump as far as in the inlets and outlets, whereas the second one seems like it will prevent a lot of splash.

overall any suggestions? Thanks!

 

[cindre2000]

Hello and

:welcome:

First of all, more water volume is always better, so yes a larger sump will be better. However, a few considerations about those sumps:

Bioballs are nitrate factories and rarely a good thing in reef tanks.
Sponges are also get full of crud very easily and start producing nitrates.
It is usually best to buy a protein skimmer separate.

and finally,

It is usually a lot cheaper to buy a glass aquarium and install baffles yourself.

 

[shavo]

I agree with cindre, The pics are blocked at my work so I can't see them until I get home but I can invisions what you are posting. He mentioned bio balls and built in protien skimmer.

I agree that you can do a glass tank with baffles and a return pump and a seperate "in sump" protien skimmer. It is cheaper and more efficient. look at Mr.X's tank build to get an idea in member tank specifications, he has a 75 gallon fuge on a 125. the bigger you can afford to go the better. I have a 30 gallon tank on my 125 and it is working perfectly. My water is very very stable. We can give you pointers if you want to DIY,
it's easy

 

[Ansphire]

What he said....

I'm in the process of making one and I can tell you first hand these guys are very helpful.

I'll post pic's of my cutting boards for you soon! lol..

 

[pinchharmonic]

hi everyone! wow thanks for all the responses!

Now I guess it's a question of whether to DIY or buy the one on e-bay.

Now the two I showed in the pictures are not super pricey, but not cheap either. One is about $100 shipped, the other is about $170 shipped (the first two pics with the green stuff in the refug). They are only the sump/refugium, no skimmer, no bio-balls.

How much does it cost for DIY? Likewise, I don't have any tools except for the typical screw drivers any household would have.

I'm also considering things like noise of the sump, how much splashing will occur, etc. I really want to keep the sump/refugium looking like another tank underneath my main because I kinda see it as another thing to showcase. I see the one's under Petco and it looks like it just snowed all over the 20g they use as the sump (salt buildup) and overall really dirty looking. Specifically, i've read about bubble trappers on the inlet to the sump, to prevent gurgles. Also read about having good covers to prevent splash.

Problem is I've never had a sump so i don't know if this bubble trapper at the inlet is useful to stop gurgling noise, and i have no idea how to stop splashing around the refugium. Do the sumps pictured satisfy those conditions?

again thanks everyone. Now i'm definitely considering building one.

 

[mr_X]

LOL @ cutting boards!

all you need is a standard aquarium, some kind of plastic to make baffles, and some aquarium caulk to hold it all together.
as far as cost is concerned, you can get a used tank from a local fish store if you like. that will save money.
i used basic kitchen cutting boards for baffles and cut them to size with a circular saw. the reason i did this, was it was the very cheapest, thick, plastic i could find.
click my build thread link below if you would like to see what i did.

if you are to use an in-sump skimmer you might look for a breeder tank. these are longer and alittle shallower than standard (more surface area).

as far as noise coming from the sump, you'll need to be creative and try different things until you are satisfied. i'm basically happy with the way mine works.
BTW, being creative, making your own, working ecosystem is a killer rush!
anyone can purchase things and connect the dots! good luck!

 

[shavo]

I hate to admit it but he's right

 

[pinchharmonic]

lol yea he's totally right

makes me feel lazy for just wanting to buy one that is already working =)


Btw, you mentioned more surface area for protein skimming...

What is a good surface area in general? Maybe half the surface of a 10 standard 10 gallon? By surface area I mean where to place the baffle that separates the protein skimming portion from the next section.

 

[shavo]

it isn't more surface area really for protien skimming it is more surface area for gas exchange. but the more surface area he means is it is more room for more equipment in the sump. if you have a longer sump you can house the skimmer and have baffles and return pump and it isn't all cramped.

 

[mr_X]

it isn't more surface area really for protien skimming it is more surface area for gas exchange. but the more surface area he means is it is more room for more equipment in the sump. if you have a longer sump you can house the skimmer and have baffles and return pump and it isn't all cramped.

yea...that. 8)

 

[cindre2000]

Splashing noise from the return can be reduced by having the water exit under the water, or having a recirculating skimmer. Some salt creep is inevitable, the larger the tank, the slower the water will move through it, and the less splashing you will get.

I personally like glass baffles that you can easily have cut to size at any hardware store.

I get absolutely no noise from my sump, it all comes from my stupid skimmer.

 

[shavo]

the exact opposite for me, mine is from my return line, I have been planning a little diy elbow in the line and running the line under the water, my skimmer is absolutely silent, (red sea berlin)

 

[pinchharmonic]

it isn't more surface area really for protien skimming it is more surface area for gas exchange. but the more surface area he means is it is more room for more equipment in the sump. if you have a longer sump you can house the skimmer and have baffles and return pump and it isn't all cramped.

i see. thanks. Do you usually put the protein skimmer in the inlet section of the sump, or can you also put it at the outlet portion?

So far in my sump i'm planning to put hte skimmer, the refugium, and also a heater. It lead me to realize that I have no mechnical filteration at all in my whole system (i'm not going to be using any cannisters or anything, the sump is my only filter except for live rock). Should I put some filter floss in the sump somewhere? Carbon? Can bioballs be a means of mechanical filtration?

 

[pinchharmonic]

Splashing noise from the return can be reduced by having the water exit under the water, or having a recirculating skimmer. Some salt creep is inevitable, the larger the tank, the slower the water will move through it, and the less splashing you will get.

I personally like glass baffles that you can easily have cut to size at any hardware store.

I get absolutely no noise from my sump, it all comes from my stupid skimmer.

There is no sort of "pressure" problem when the line is returned underwater at the sump? I was thinking since my overflow box is powered by gravity and water pressure to get the water down to the sump, addittional reverse pressure due to the line underwater at the sump could slow the flow.

 

[cindre2000]

I am very careful about my overflows and have very little running through them. I have two 1" overflows on my 30 gallon cube. With this lower flow, I do not get pressure problems; however, if you are trying to run the maximum amount through the overflow you will need to drill a small hole in the drain right above the water level in that sump section to vent air.

As for the protein skimmer- It Is The Mechanical Filtration! You could put in a micron filter sock over the drain (however, these do clog quickly). As for skimmer location. Most people prefer to place the skimmer before the refugium so that it does not skim out all the "good" stuff that grows in the refugium (plankton/pods).