New to saltwater, open to advice

[noobzy]

Hi everyone,

I've wanted a saltwater reef since as far back as I can remember, and have been waiting and reading patiently for quite some time. I'd like to think that I know as much as I am going to know from casual reading, and I decided it's time to dive in and see how I fare.

Anyhow, to the point, I liberated a 6 month cycled 10g eclipse from someone via craigslist last week, and am letting it settle in its new location for a little while (with consistent testing) before I make any modifications.

My eventual goal is to make it into a stable reef tank. Here is the plan and, of course, the part where I could use some advice :

Current Setup:
The tank is currently set up with 15lb or so of sand, a fake rubber coral, the stock filtration (biowheel, etc) and light. I have a digital thermometer and a 4.5W Koralia Nano on the way. The tank currently houses 3 striped damsels, 1 percula clown and 1 hermit crab.



Plan and Questions:

• I got the eclipse because it was an affordable all-in-one, but I am aware that it's not the best setup for a reef. Once I know what I am doing, I'll upgrade to something more suitable. In the meantime, I am looking for new lighting (something like this seems like a good option..)
• Can I trust the sand to be stocked with all the critters I need, or should I replace it little by little with new sand that I can trust? Is replacing the sand a bad idea?
• Removing the fake coral and adding some live rock is my next step, but I am a little hesitant to make any large changes; if I get 10lb of cured live rock, can I just add it all at once?
• Based on what I've read, the 4 fish might be a little too much for a small tank, so I am considering giving away the damsels to someone with a larger home. They've apparently been fine for half a year though, so I haven't decided if it's necessary yet.
• Is the filtration adequate, or do I need to replace that as well?
• Can I use dechlorinated tap water, or do I need to use distilled? Where is a good place to get large quantities of distilled water other than my local grocery store?

Thanks!

Looking forward to becoming a part of this community .

 

[Chiefmcfuz]

Welcome to MR.

 

[russellbravo]

1. you should look into an AIO system. current makes the solana and its by far the best tanks for your buck. (i own one and i love it) you should aim to get lighting that u will use later on when u do upgrade, rather than buying another fixture. look around for 4x24 t5 fixture. keep an eye out in the marketplace. u'll be surprised how cheap things are.


2. replacing the sand is def ur preference. consider color and size of the sand if u do intend on replacing it. size of sand will matter depending on the flow our ur tank.

3. you can add all the cured rock all at once, but might go through another cycle because of the die offs.

4. you can keep the fish for now, until you upgrade (which in this hobby is inevitable)

5. save urself the hassle. either buy a RODI unit or buy water from ur LFS.

6. welcome to MR, a supplement for ur reefing addiction.

 

[tentacles]

If you decide not to go reef, you can use treated distilled water for a fish only tank, but for a reef tank it is advisable to go with RO/DI, or at least DI- it'll save you a lot of money and frustration in the long run. Odds are the sand in your tank is not populated with any little critters (I could be wrong, but since the original owner opted for plastic coral, I'm going to guess that they didn't buy live sand.)

I don't like futzing around or taking risks when it comes to living creatures, so IMO, I would start fresh if I were you.(this is just my opinion, other people will tell you that you don't have to start fresh, and if they are comfortable messing around with the tank then that's fine for them, but I personally wouldn't do it.) I would start be doing water changes with saltwater made with RO/DI, until all the filtered tap is out. You don't want to do it all at once and shock the system.I would get rid of at least two of the damsels- that tank is pretty small and they can get to be nasty little buggers. Add new live sand, then live rock, and let your cycle begin. The most important thing in this hobby is to be very patient . You can kick start your cycle by dosing bacterial additives like Special Blend, or adding a piece of an an uncooked cocktail shrimp, for the bacteria to feed off of, but these methods will NOT replace the normal nitrogen cycle. It's actually really interesting to watch a tank cycle, you start to see all kinds of little creatures scurrying about when the lights are out. If you're adding fully cured live rock from an established tank, there might not be much of a cycle, but there will most likely be some die off, so keep an eye on your trates, trites and ammonia. When your trates, trites, amon, read 0, then you can add your cleanup crew (CUC,) which would be some hermits and snails. See how they do- if they don't fare well then do not add anymore livestock. After you've been so patient and haven't jumped the gun to add a yellow tang to your new 10g tank within the first three days that its been running, and the tank is ready for some livestock, try some cheap, hardy test corals like zoanthids or mushrooms, (or one of each!) You could probably add a small fish a few days after this as long as your params stay normal. Like I said, the most important thing in this hobby is to be very patient, it will be very rewarding in the end:flower:.

Also, it's VERY nice to see someone who has been going about the proper channels and doing lots of research before they start blindly stocking their tank, and I (and I know other members as well,) applaud you for that :party:. This is a great hobby but a lot of people rush into it WAY too quickly and end up wasting a ton of money, and cost a lot of living organisms their lives. If done correctly, you can actually keep a really badass little nano reef

 

[aznt1217]

Welcome.

In addition to all the advice above. Here are my 2 cents.

I got the eclipse because it was an affordable all-in-one, but I am aware that it's not the best setup for a reef. Once I know what I am doing, I'll upgrade to something more suitable. In the meantime, I am looking for new lighting (something like this seems like a good option..)
Like the response above, check out a Solana/Red Sea Max 130/250. I don't know how much room you have so it'll depend on your budget and space, etc. For lighting on a 10 gallon I would pick up a 2 bulb T5 or a LED system of some sort. Shouldn't require much lighting. www.nanotuners.com sells the Evil PAR38 Lamp. Awesome light and it would work well on that tank.
Can I trust the sand to be stocked with all the critters I need, or should I replace it little by little with new sand that I can trust? Is replacing the sand a bad idea?
It depends on how established this sand bed is. I would not add any sand because it can potentially cause a cycle again. If you do though I would slowly take the sand out and slowly add sand in simultaneously. Arag Alive would be good because it's already cycled. Another option is switching out the sand bed when you empty out all contents into a tank into a bucket for like 1 week or however long it takes the mini cycle to end. Critters will come with time.
Removing the fake coral and adding some live rock is my next step, but I am a little hesitant to make any large changes; if I get 10lb of cured live rock, can I just add it all at once?
If you do this you have to make sure the Live rock is fully cured to avoid a cycle. I would put the cured liverock in a bucket with a heater and powerhead and let it cure on the safe side and then add it into the tank to avoid die off from transportation when you get it.
Based on what I've read, the 4 fish might be a little too much for a small tank, so I am considering giving away the damsels to someone with a larger home. They've apparently been fine for half a year though, so I haven't decided if it's necessary yet.
This is a hotly debated topic. I tend to go against all rules but in a 10 gallon I would look at the size of the fish and maximum size. More importantly, tempermant and the order in which they are added will matter as well. If I had a 10. I would put 2 small clowns, a yellow watchman goby or a jawfish, a firefish, and perhaps something else that I feel would be cool. Obviously stay on top of your water changes.
Is the filtration adequate, or do I need to replace that as well?
Once you get Liverock you should be okay. On a tank that size just have the hang on back filter run carbon and you should be okay.
Can I use dechlorinated tap water, or do I need to use distilled? Where is a good place to get large quantities of distilled water other than my local grocery store?
As tentacles said, I would go with an RODI. If you do not have the space they make a mighty mite RODI which is very small. Distilled water I'd assume you just go to Duane Reade or whever. You'd probably need like 1 Gallon a week for water changes. It can and will get costly. Just get the RODI and save yourself the trouble. Dechlorinated water will depend on your system. I do not know where you live and how their water system is set up. It's hard to tell as well.

 

[Imbarrie]

Wow that was a lot.

Just want to add;

You can seed that sand and it will become live sand, you dont have to replace it. You can seed it from live rock or sand from an established tank.

You can buy bottled pre-made saltwater from Petco in 5 gallon containers. I know one of the mods in this site uses that exclusively in his Solana. That is about the only thing I would recommend getting from Petco. Two are all you need. Change 1-2 gallons per week.
But right now I would do two consecutive 5 gallon water changes to reduce any tap water. RODI filters take up quite a bit of room in an UES apartment and you dont absolutely need one right away.

Keep about a gallon of distilled or RODI fresh water for top-off. Since only fresh water evaporates it has to be replaced with fresh water only.

Keep an eye on water temp with an all in one.

Get yourself to Manhattan Aquariums, its mid town on the far west side.

 

[motortrendz]

only thing i can add, and im sure its already known,
but read, research, and ask questions if your not sure.. dont assume anything and we are here to help!!

good luck and welcome to MR..

 

[aznt1217]

Wow that was a lot.

Just want to add;

You can seed that sand and it will become live sand, you dont have to replace it. You can seed it from live rock or sand from an established tank.

You can buy bottled pre-made saltwater from Petco in 5 gallon containers. I know one of the mods in this site uses that exclusively in his Solana. That is about the only thing I would recommend getting from Petco. Two are all you need. Change 1-2 gallons per week.
But right now I would do two consecutive 5 gallon water changes to reduce any tap water. RODI filters take up quite a bit of room in an UES apartment and you dont absolutely need one right away.

Keep about a gallon of distilled or RODI fresh water for top-off. Since only fresh water evaporates it has to be replaced with fresh water only.

Keep an eye on water temp with an all in one.

Get yourself to Manhattan Aquariums, its mid town on the far west side.

How do we know he doesn't have a penthouse? :redface:

 

[noobzy]

Thanks, everyone, for the warm welcome and the various tidbits of advice; reading is great, and I'll only do more of it now that I actually have some little fellas counting on me, but a little direct help goes a long way

I looked at a lot of AIOs over the past few weeks; the Bio/Nano cubes look like TVs (this is a bad thing, IMO) and mildly expensive, and the RedSea/Solanas are gorgeous but way out of my current price range... maybe soon? I'll continue to research and see if I have any better options. The last thing I want to do is build up a reef and have it all die because I missed a step.

I see your point, Tentacles. I guess I should have just done it all right the first time around instead of taking the shorter route, but at least these fellas will be given a better home (unless they die in the process, which would be awful). I'll decide on an upgrade strategy soon and start cycling a new tank in the coming months (I'm up to speed on cycling, no worries there).

The damsels are really nasty... they're being mean to the clown. Apparently, he isn't allowed near the fake coral, cause they gang up on him and chase him away every time he tries. Should I intervene?

Thanks for the detailed response, Aznt. Lighting suggestion taken into consideration; I'll figure out how big I want my next tank and probably get a 2-bulb T5 that will fit. LEDs are a little more expensive I think... but I'll look at those too.

I think I am going to pick up some LR this weekend from another Manhattan Reefer. I'll follow your steps when I do it.

Thanks for the advice, Imbarrie. Water from Petco is perfect for my current situation, and on your advice I've already stopped by there today to pick some up. I'll do some more reading on RO/DI setups, and it'll probably be a good investment when I am ready to upgrade. Manhattan Aquariums looked cool when I found it on the internet a few weeks ago, but it's been hard to find the time to stop by - it'll be a weekend trip very soon though. Aznt, I do live on the top floor... unfortunately, it isn't exactly a penthouse. The 5 gallon from Petco is just perfect, cause I don't think I could carry any more up six flights of stairs

 

[greenycrew]

I don't really know what you can do by intervening as far as getting rid of either the damsels or the clown. Damsels can be really nasty and once they have their territory staked quite aggressive. I would give away one or the other.

 

[fallenlordz]

I would get rid of those striped damsels and get a partner for that clownfish.:smash:

I find that clownfish are more fun to watch. LOL

 

[Imbarrie]

5th floor walk-up. The things we do to live in the coolest city.

Used to have a one bedroom on the upper west side. I didnt have a tank then, but you got me thinking what would have worked for me in that situation.

I think, for the future peace you want from your tank, you should evict the damsels and find a friend for your clown. Maybe a tiny clown of the same species, after the tank settles down.

I liked sexy shrimp also when I had a nano. They are great in groups of 3 or more, very social.

 

[tentacles]

I liked sexy shrimp also when I had a nano. They are great in groups of 3 or more, very social.

They also do that sassy little dance that is really cool to watch :wink1:.

 

[isgon26]

Welcome!!

 

[Imbarrie]

I have some yellow polyps and xenia you can have as starter stuff. I keep a tiny bit in my tank and give away the overgrowth. Lmk I can meet downtown on weekday lunch time.


Sent from my iPhone using Reefs

 

[noobzy]

I have some yellow polyps and xenia you can have as starter stuff. I keep a tiny bit in my tank and give away the overgrowth. Lmk I can meet downtown on weekday lunch time.


Sent from my iPhone using Reefs

Thanks so much! Sounds perfect for a beginner like me; much appreciated

However, can I get back to you later in the week once I know how my tank is doing with the rock (picking it up on Sunday)? Also, despite the hardy nature of xenia and yellow polyps, should I upgrade my lighting setup before I bring any corals home?

 

[noobzy]

Hi everyone,

The rock/sand implant seems to have gone well. For some reason, today was pretty damn cold in NY, but everything seems to have survived the trip. I'll of course be testing consistently to watch for any chemical spikes, but these were part of someone's established aquarium for a while so I don't expect any trouble.

Can I get some help with identifications?

I never quite figured out what kind of hermit I have (trying to determine how big/fast he will grow):


I also just had this little fella emerge from the rocks... didn't expect him, so he was kind of a shocker (he's named Freddy cause he's so damn scary... I'm glad he didn't decide to tickle me when I was transferring the rocks - I might have freaked):

 

[chrisb3]

Not sure about the hermit, but the bottom fella is an emerald crab.

 

[noobzy]

Thanks, Chrisb3. I actually found the "identification" forum and posted there as well - will do that next time from the get-go.

Quick update on the tank:
Over the weekend, I added sand, rocks and soft corals (2 Kenyas and a Xenia that were attached to said rocks)

• The addition has caused a spike in Nitrates (10 ppm), but I am leaving as-is for now. If it doesn't get better by tomorrow, I will do a 40% water change. Advice? These rocks and the sand came from an established tank, so I wasn't expecting a cycle to start...
• Freddy, the emerald crab, died First fatality for my tank, and I feel awful. He was down three legs somehow, and I think the trip was the cause. If I'd known he was hitchhiking on the rocks, it might have been preventable...
• The corals were half-closed when they were first introduced to the tank. Since then, they've expanded to their full size, shriveled up completely (randomly, and then again when I moved the rocks around), expanded again, and then semi-deflated today while I was at work. I know my lighting is somewhat inadequate, but I was under the impression that they would survive while I took my time upgrading. Advice?
• I just added a Korelia 4.5W powerhead to the mix, thinking that everyone wanted some current, but the clown is hiding in the corner, the damsels are distressed, and the corals have shriveled up completely. Should I give them time to acclimate, or just remove it?
• The damsels are loving the new rock arrangements and darting through all the cracks they can find... but, despite the new activities, they are continuing to be aggressive towards the clown. Is there anything I can do to help keep the peace, or is it time to give them away?

Thanks again, everyone, for all the help!

 

[aznt1217]

Many little issues here. I'd do a 10% water change as soon as possible.

Coral shriveling up could be due to many reasons, maybe it is because they are in a new tank, maybe it's the movement of rocks, maybe it's the flow, who knows?

Make sure your koralia isn't hitting anything directly. Bounce the flow off of the glass so theres a nice spread.

Take the damsels out like Fallen Lordz said.