A
Anonymous
Guest
Does the lighting type even matter when there's a ton of it over a small tank?
Peace,
Chip
Peace,
Chip
A
Anonymous
Guest
96w over a 15 gallon isn't that much, in absolute terms. Back in 97-98, I ran a 15 with a 175w halide.
Anyways, for a dedicated SPS and clams tank, I'd use more wattage. Type won't matter too much, but for ease of stacking the wattage onto a small tank MH is usually far easier.
Anyways, for a dedicated SPS and clams tank, I'd use more wattage. Type won't matter too much, but for ease of stacking the wattage onto a small tank MH is usually far easier.
A
Anonymous
Guest
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by cjdevito:
<strong>96w over a 15 gallon isn't that much, in absolute terms. Back in 97-98, I ran a 15 with a 175w halide.
Anyways, for a dedicated SPS and clams tank, I'd use more wattage. Type won't matter too much, but for ease of stacking the wattage onto a small tank MH is usually far easier.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Was the 175 watt halide the only light over the tank, or did you have enough room to supplement with actinic?
Thanks,
Chip
<strong>96w over a 15 gallon isn't that much, in absolute terms. Back in 97-98, I ran a 15 with a 175w halide.
Anyways, for a dedicated SPS and clams tank, I'd use more wattage. Type won't matter too much, but for ease of stacking the wattage onto a small tank MH is usually far easier.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Was the 175 watt halide the only light over the tank, or did you have enough room to supplement with actinic?
Thanks,
Chip
A
Anonymous
Guest
Actually I would say yes it is with some qualifiers.
I'm assuming you mean one of the new 24" Quad bulbs. All by itself and all white it would likely be fine but very yellow. If it is split 50/50 than most likely not because the blue light really doesn't give much for PAR so you in effect have a 48W daylight.
In a standard 24x12x12 15 if you use a 4-6" sandbed and thus only have to penetrate 6-8" of water you can get away with at least SPS with that setup but I would consider a 175W 10K German or the 14K Belgian if you don't want to add supp blue.
and no type never matters much just sheer intensity and appropriate color spectrum.
[ January 10, 2002: Message edited by: MickAv8r ]</p>
I'm assuming you mean one of the new 24" Quad bulbs. All by itself and all white it would likely be fine but very yellow. If it is split 50/50 than most likely not because the blue light really doesn't give much for PAR so you in effect have a 48W daylight.
In a standard 24x12x12 15 if you use a 4-6" sandbed and thus only have to penetrate 6-8" of water you can get away with at least SPS with that setup but I would consider a 175W 10K German or the 14K Belgian if you don't want to add supp blue.
and no type never matters much just sheer intensity and appropriate color spectrum.
[ January 10, 2002: Message edited by: MickAv8r ]</p>
marillion, currently I have a 15g setup with
130watts of PC lighting. I never imagined putting any SPS into the system. If I did I would go for the MH 175watt. I can tell you that on a piece of live rock I have, came a unidentified encrusting SPS. Within the last month and a half it has been growing like a weed. So it can be done.
130watts of PC lighting. I never imagined putting any SPS into the system. If I did I would go for the MH 175watt. I can tell you that on a piece of live rock I have, came a unidentified encrusting SPS. Within the last month and a half it has been growing like a weed. So it can be done.
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by marillion:
Yes, I was looking at a Quad bulb page and that's what led me to think about it. So I would have to go with the all-white bulbs to get the PAR up to a point where the SPS would thrive, is that it?<hr></blockquote>
Depends on depth of the water you need to penetrate. For example, we have a 10 gallon nano with a large orange montipora capricornis. The tank is lit by 2x32W PC's one daylight one blue. There is 3-4" of sand in the bottom and the water depth is 8". The lights are suspended 5" over the top of the tank. Nobody who has seen it would claim the SPS in the tank aren't thriving however because of placement the light only has to penetrate 5" of air and on average 3" of water. The lighting for this is more than sufficient. So in all reality the 50/50 quad *may* actually be sufficient for captive bred SPS.
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote
Up to you. A 14K Belgian would look nice, though if it were my tank I'd probably opt for a 20 gal H (same footprint just a bit taller) and run a 150W HQI (that bulb puts out more par than most 175's supposedly according to Sanjay's most recent numbers).
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote
It's a little deductive reasoning. Take the following into account when considering aquarium lighting:
1. If the bulb is new to the market, manufacturer's color temp is likely to be completely useless because it is a marketing term not reality. i.e. 12K ALS, 10K Blueline etc
2. Color temp is only indicative of what the bulb MAY look like, not what it looks like. A 5500K Venture is much whiter than a 6500K Iwasaki, a 10K Coraldeath is much bluer than a 14K Belgian etc
3. As a general rule, the bluer the bulb the less PAR, lumen output. I.e. 96W 6700K PC = 8100 lumens, 96W blue "actinic" = 2450 lumens same holds true for PAR on MH bulbs see Sanjay's article in the 2002 Reef Annual.
4. When choosing lighting for an aquarium, type doesn't matter. A coral really doesn't care if the light is from a PC, VHO or Metal Halide if the lumen/par is the same. Thus you make your decision based upon what will give you the appropriate amount of light the most economically.
5. On smaller tanks PC's or VHO's tend to be the most economical. However on a tank like a 90 gallon (48Lx18Wx24H) getting the appropriate intensity is much more economical with MH bulbs i.e. 2x250 than trying to duplicate it with VHO or PC's.
6. Finally to go back over color/temp lumen issue one must keep in mind the bulb they do pick. Take the 90 gallon example I used above. For general reef use i.e. a mixture of everything including SPS and Clams - dual 250's will be fine over that tank provided you pick a bulb like the 6500K Iwasaki, a 10K German or 5500K. Should you opt for the blue bulbs like the 10K Blueline, "Euro" or 12K ALS I would strongly suggest adding either PC or VHO daylights to pump up the par or go to 400W bulbs because of the general poor output of those bulbs.
[ January 10, 2002: Message edited by: MickAv8r ]</p>
Yes, I was looking at a Quad bulb page and that's what led me to think about it. So I would have to go with the all-white bulbs to get the PAR up to a point where the SPS would thrive, is that it?<hr></blockquote>
Depends on depth of the water you need to penetrate. For example, we have a 10 gallon nano with a large orange montipora capricornis. The tank is lit by 2x32W PC's one daylight one blue. There is 3-4" of sand in the bottom and the water depth is 8". The lights are suspended 5" over the top of the tank. Nobody who has seen it would claim the SPS in the tank aren't thriving however because of placement the light only has to penetrate 5" of air and on average 3" of water. The lighting for this is more than sufficient. So in all reality the 50/50 quad *may* actually be sufficient for captive bred SPS.
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote
Up to you. A 14K Belgian would look nice, though if it were my tank I'd probably opt for a 20 gal H (same footprint just a bit taller) and run a 150W HQI (that bulb puts out more par than most 175's supposedly according to Sanjay's most recent numbers).
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote
It's a little deductive reasoning. Take the following into account when considering aquarium lighting:
1. If the bulb is new to the market, manufacturer's color temp is likely to be completely useless because it is a marketing term not reality. i.e. 12K ALS, 10K Blueline etc
2. Color temp is only indicative of what the bulb MAY look like, not what it looks like. A 5500K Venture is much whiter than a 6500K Iwasaki, a 10K Coraldeath is much bluer than a 14K Belgian etc
3. As a general rule, the bluer the bulb the less PAR, lumen output. I.e. 96W 6700K PC = 8100 lumens, 96W blue "actinic" = 2450 lumens same holds true for PAR on MH bulbs see Sanjay's article in the 2002 Reef Annual.
4. When choosing lighting for an aquarium, type doesn't matter. A coral really doesn't care if the light is from a PC, VHO or Metal Halide if the lumen/par is the same. Thus you make your decision based upon what will give you the appropriate amount of light the most economically.
5. On smaller tanks PC's or VHO's tend to be the most economical. However on a tank like a 90 gallon (48Lx18Wx24H) getting the appropriate intensity is much more economical with MH bulbs i.e. 2x250 than trying to duplicate it with VHO or PC's.
6. Finally to go back over color/temp lumen issue one must keep in mind the bulb they do pick. Take the 90 gallon example I used above. For general reef use i.e. a mixture of everything including SPS and Clams - dual 250's will be fine over that tank provided you pick a bulb like the 6500K Iwasaki, a 10K German or 5500K. Should you opt for the blue bulbs like the 10K Blueline, "Euro" or 12K ALS I would strongly suggest adding either PC or VHO daylights to pump up the par or go to 400W bulbs because of the general poor output of those bulbs.
[ January 10, 2002: Message edited by: MickAv8r ]</p>
Was the 175 watt halide the only light over the tank, or did you have enough room to supplement with actinic?
That tank just had 1 10000K halide and no other lighting. I was using one of ALS (now long discontinued) modular fixtures (basically, a boxy pendent on an extendable rail system. The rails support the light about 10" above the tank, and at the ends they turn downwards and support the entire setup on the side rims of the tank), which made adding supplementary lighting just about impossible.
I've only got a handful of photos from that tank, all of which are really lousy. But if you don't mind looking at a bad pic, here's one
If it were me, now, setting up a 15g as an SPS and clam tank, I'd go for one of the following for lighting:
1 - a 150w HQI 10000K
2 - a 150w iwasaki 50000K (still new to the market, so I can't comment on it's longevity)
3 - a 400w 10000K or 20000K. Yes, I know, it seems like a lot of wattage. Just think of the 15 gallon as being equivalent to the part of a 90 gallon directly under the halide, though
I'd also say cost really isn't that high on some of these setups. For a 150w 50000K setup, you can snag a PFO 150w ballast for, what, $115? And that bulb only runs ~$60.
[ January 10, 2002: Message edited by: cjdevito ]</p>
That tank just had 1 10000K halide and no other lighting. I was using one of ALS (now long discontinued) modular fixtures (basically, a boxy pendent on an extendable rail system. The rails support the light about 10" above the tank, and at the ends they turn downwards and support the entire setup on the side rims of the tank), which made adding supplementary lighting just about impossible.
I've only got a handful of photos from that tank, all of which are really lousy. But if you don't mind looking at a bad pic, here's one
If it were me, now, setting up a 15g as an SPS and clam tank, I'd go for one of the following for lighting:
1 - a 150w HQI 10000K
2 - a 150w iwasaki 50000K (still new to the market, so I can't comment on it's longevity)
3 - a 400w 10000K or 20000K. Yes, I know, it seems like a lot of wattage. Just think of the 15 gallon as being equivalent to the part of a 90 gallon directly under the halide, though
I'd also say cost really isn't that high on some of these setups. For a 150w 50000K setup, you can snag a PFO 150w ballast for, what, $115? And that bulb only runs ~$60.
[ January 10, 2002: Message edited by: cjdevito ]</p>
My 12k then 10k 150 hqi on my 18 tall needed no supplementation either. Perfect color...Theres pics of my tank on my site.
here incase you dont see it
members.home.net/jasonco6
The tank isnt up and running anymore...but worked great when it did.
GO hqi.
here incase you dont see it
members.home.net/jasonco6
The tank isnt up and running anymore...but worked great when it did.
GO hqi.
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by MickAv8r:
<strong>I'm assuming you mean one of the new 24" Quad bulbs. All by itself and all white it would likely be fine but very yellow. If it is split 50/50 than most likely not because the blue light really doesn't give much for PAR so you in effect have a 48W daylight.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yes, I was looking at a Quad bulb page and that's what led me to think about it. So I would have to go with the all-white bulbs to get the PAR up to a point where the SPS would thrive, is that it?
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote
So the best bet would be to get a 175W halide and then add some supplemental blue?
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr><strong>and no type never matters much just sheer intensity and appropriate color spectrum.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Where do I find that information?
Thanks for the help!
Peace,
Chip
<strong>I'm assuming you mean one of the new 24" Quad bulbs. All by itself and all white it would likely be fine but very yellow. If it is split 50/50 than most likely not because the blue light really doesn't give much for PAR so you in effect have a 48W daylight.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yes, I was looking at a Quad bulb page and that's what led me to think about it. So I would have to go with the all-white bulbs to get the PAR up to a point where the SPS would thrive, is that it?
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote
So the best bet would be to get a 175W halide and then add some supplemental blue?
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr><strong>and no type never matters much just sheer intensity and appropriate color spectrum.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Where do I find that information?
Thanks for the help!
Peace,
Chip
Sure why not...but as mentioned..thats not a ton of light.
I ran my 18 tall nano reef for the whole time it was up with 1 150 watt HQI metal halide bulb...Intense as heck.
That would work for a clam tank for sure !
GL. You can keep almost anything in a small tank in regards to corals..just please dont get a tang!
lol
I ran my 18 tall nano reef for the whole time it was up with 1 150 watt HQI metal halide bulb...Intense as heck.
That would work for a clam tank for sure !
GL. You can keep almost anything in a small tank in regards to corals..just please dont get a tang!
lol
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