Feedback on IPSF.

[dragon0121]

It would be a cold day in he!! before I pay a company, like IPSF, for the cost of critters and shipping, that was never even attempted delivery. Everybody standing up for IPSF seems to ignore this. If an order leaves your place of business, and the shipping company routes it around the country then back to you, do you bill your customer for the price of the goods and shipping? Yeah, right! As for altering a contract, here were I work, that is standard practice, we add paragraphs, change wording, delete lines, and sign and send back. If the other company signs and/or does business with us they accepted the contract, that's the way the legal system surrounding contracts work.

Sounds like a case of IPSF looking to make a fast buck from a customer they assume they have already lost, so why not gouge for all they can right now. But that's just my opinion! :lol:

 

[Anonymous]

But you still haven't shown where IPSF screwed up. And I think that is important, and that's the point that Righty and I are trying to make. The title of your thread is inflammatory against IPSF who did nothing wrong. Had the title of the thread been "FedEx sucks!!" I don't think we would have had problems, but you are suggesting that the blame lies solely on IPSF who did everything in their power to make you happy customer, including being up front about their policies, and then sticking by them exactly as they stated. If you choose not to do business with them because they use FedEx, and they aren't reliable enough for your situation that is up to you as well. But don't blast someone for some one elses mistake. The credit card company is going to take care of the charges any way right? I have a hard time believing that a couple of emails will hold up as a contract anyway, or they at least won't supercede the contract that you agreed to by iniating an ordering and agreeing to abide by their policies.

Sounds like a case of IPSF looking to make a fast buck from a customer they assume they have already lost, so why not gouge for all they can right now

This is what I have a problem with about the tone you started the thread with.

 

[Hal1]

Hmmm, it seems pretty straightforward to me. It really all hinges on who assumed responsibility for errors by the shipper: IPSF or Rover. If it was IPSF, then even if FedEx screwed up, they did it as agents of IPSF, and therefore, ultimately IPSF is at fault. The same holds true for Rover.

Rover, being an (almost) lawyer, check your contract: was it FOB, etc.? This should tell you who had responsibility for the shipper. I can't remember what the default is, but I would guess that it would be IPSF.

'IPSF assumes no liability for losses, claims or damages if you (or anyone at your address) refuses delivery, or if you instruct Fedex to return your unopened box to IPSF. Taking either of these actions voids our guarantee'.

-This is an interesting clause, but I would think that it only applies to deliveries that are ON TIME. I think that because this delivery was 4 days late, it's a technicality, and a weak one, to require Rover to accept delivery. Certainly Rover would be in a stronger position if he/she had done so, as this seems to be the point that IPSF is relying upon. Plus, I'm not clear if FedEx returned the package based on Rover's say so (not helpful to Rover), or on their own initiative (good for Rover).

If you search the posts here and elsewhere, you'll see a mixed bag regarding IPSF customer service. Plenty of people say that Gerald is top notch, and many people say exactly the opposite. It's a pity that IPSF doesn't seem to have their act together for customer service. I know that it's hurting their sales, because I for one have postponed my order of 9 for $99 because I've seen too much negative publicity. I may decide to place it down the road, but right now I'm not comfortable ordering from IPSF.

There's a reason Sears is so popular: The customer is always right. Yeah, occasionally Sears is taken advantage of by less than scrupulous customers. In the long run, however, they've built a loyal following because people know that they won't be hassled if something goes wrong with the sale.

 

[t-byrd]

as for their statement that is difficult to make a claim,
its not that hard. we do it all the time if ups/fedex screws up.
you make a few phone calls, fill out a couple forms, and its done.
as for the saturday delivery, the volume is alot lower so they dont
need all the drivers working. they shouldnt offer the service if they cant perform. the cost is considerably higher, to cover for the fact that it costs
the shipping company more to have employees in on a saturday.

 

[Anonymous]

Just to clarify:

Rook is the one who had the problems with IPSF. I'm just a conscientious observer.

 

[dtiedke]

Am I missing something here? They have a claim with FedEx. They will get their money for FedEx's mistake. So the vendor is out nothing.

Since FedEx has acknowledged their mistake, why wouldn't the vendor file the claim? If the vendor chooses that it is not worth the effort to file the claim, then they cannot expect the customer to pay for the order which they did not receive.

Seems pretty clear to me. FedEx messed up, they admit it. They are willing to pay for that mistake. All the vendor has to do is file the claim. But the vendor is already paid now, so why put forth the effort to make things right by submitting the claim?

Well, because I was going to order thousands of dollars from this vendor, and based on this thread I doubt I will be making that order.... Is this true? Not likely...but businesses get reputations by this type of activity...and who knows what the impact of this thread is having on others who might be shopping for this vendor's products.

Bottom line, the vendor would be out nothing if they accepted FedEx's offer of relief, yet they are expecting the CUSTOMER to pay for an admitted mistake made by FedEx because (as it seems to me) they are not willing to make a tiny extra effort to make the claim against FedEx. This is bad business no matter what, however less bad than another senario where the vendor can (and might) make BOTH FedEx and the cutomer pay (doubling the profit on this order).

Now I ask this.....is it worth the bad will caused this one customer, and the countless number of others that might view this vendor in a negative way because they are being unreasonable?

I do not agree that the customer is always right. However, it does seem that the customer is right on this one. If he instructed FedEx to return the package, that would be different. But the reason for the package being returned isn't even the issue here. FedEx is admitting fault, and the vendor has a means of recovering the cost of this order.

As a business owner, I know that it takes 20 times more effort to gain a customer than it does to keep one....seems to me that this vendor should value the clients they have, and do the right thing.


my .02 cents worth....


Dave

 

[dtiedke]

Rover....IPFS did not screw up the shipping. That was never accused. They are, however, handling the situation very badly....I think that that was the whole point of the thread.

The screw up on IPFS is the way they are handling the situation....not the shipping.


Seems that way to me anyway....


Dave

 

[teevee]

“PLEASE NOTE THAT THIS MUST BE DELIVERED ON FEBRUARY 8TH 2003. DELIVERIES AT
A TIME OTHER THAN THIS DATE WILL NOT BE ACCEPTED AS I WILL NOT BE AROUND TO
RECEIVE IT AND ACCLIMATE THE ANIMALS PROPERLY”

“I need the items delivered to me on Saturday, Feburary 4th, 2003. THIS IS A MUST. I will not be available to accept the delivery at any other time. Therefore, if this cannot be meet please inform me and I will need to reschedule this.”

Does anybody else find this to be very confusing?

it's legalese, innit.

 

[Anonymous]

Rook,

Please post your email with IPSF regarding the screw up. The tone of the email may shed light on why the denied you 'relief'.

 

[Expos Forever]

By coincidence yesterday I got an e-mail from a work-at-home scam type thing. All about being a Fedex-UPS claims processor and how many companies will not go through the trouble of filing claims.

http://trialoffers.com/wsoffers/rp/refundrecovery.html

IMO though, if a company refuses to make the effort to file a claim, then it should be on their nickel and not passed on to the customer... The customer paid extra for Saturday delivery so he could properly acclimate his animals. Seems noble enough to me. The fact that the Saturday delivery was set-up proves to me that there was no confusion on IPSF's part.

I also believe though that there are two sides to every story. Since this is a public forum maybe somebody (Rook?) should advise IPSF this conversation is going on so they can at least present their side? Just a thought.

 

[Anemone]

IIRC, FedEx will only refund the shipping charges on a claim caused by late delivery. The only way they pay for damage to contents is if the box is trashed.

Many of the critters (especially in detrivore kits) may well have survived until Monday evening (and rook could have been credited the shipping charges plus given a "store credit" for the DOA animals), but rook refused delivery and told FedEx not to deliver - so they sent it back.

The perfect situation would have been for rook to accept late delivery and note which animals were dead. IPSF would recieve a credit/refund from FedEx for the shipping charges, so they could ship out replacement animals for the DOAs at no charge. Now, however, there is a much greater probablility that all the animals will be dead, plus FedEx may well charge IPSF for the refused delivery shipping charges - so even if they get credi for the initial shipping charges, they may still be out for the return shipping charges.

I think there's plenty of fault to go around in this situation (FedEx for poor shipping, Rook for refusal to accept the box when that is a stated policy on the website, and IPSF for not figuring out a better way to handle this).

Kevin

 

[ReefRian]

Many of the critters (especially in detrivore kits) may well have survived until Monday evening (and rook could have been credited the shipping charges plus given a "store credit" for the DOA animals), but rook refused delivery and told FedEx not to deliver - so they sent it back.

Kevin, I think you misunderstood. He did not tell them to send the box back to IPSF, Fed Ex did this on their own, and he did not refuse delivery because he was never given the chance to. He did wished they had sent it to him instead of IPSF.

Rian

 

[Anonymous]

Kevin, I think you misunderstood. He did not tell them to send the box back to IPSF, Fed Ex did this on their own, and he did not refuse delivery because he was never given the chance to. He did wished they had sent it to him instead of IPSF.

I think it is pretty clear he gave FedEx the impression that he did not want the delivery because everything would probobly be dead. It is very possible that Rook, in his angry conversation with FedEx, actually told them not to bother with delivery because everything would be dead anyway. What is clear he did not do was tell FedEx to deliver it anyway, as per the policy on the IPSF website.

 

[Rook]

Ok, I think I need to restate some points that seem to be misunderstood.

1) I did not refuse the shippment.
2) The agreement was for Saturday shippment only, specifically stating that no late shippment would be able to be accepted.
3) FEDEX made the mistake, NOT IPSF. IPSF though is FedEx's customer, and thus FedEx is IPSF's agent. Therefore, only IPSF can make a claim to FedEx, and any mistake made by FedEx and attributed to IPSF.


Also, I recently found that FedEx also had stated that the shippment was refused on their website, which may have been (I am speculating here) the reason IPSF believes this is so. I contacted FedEx and they agree that I did not refuse the shippment, and they will change this.

Righty, you are right that the tone of the title of this email is maybe too harsh. FedEx is the one who has created this problem in the first instance. My problem is with IPSF and the way they are handling the situation.

It is my understanding (maybe right maybe wrong) that IPSF's policy requiring you to accept late shippments is to protect themselfs from FedEx, buy being able to prove that the late shipment is what caused the death of the animal. I can understand this. But, I altered this condition with the Saturday only agreement. If I were to take Monday off work I would at least be out a lot more money than the cost of the package, or I would be out of a job. That is why I created the condition in the first place. If it was unacceptable, it should have been refused.


BUT, all is not lost. IPSF and I, after many heated emails back and forth, may yet work something out. IPSF, has agreed that I should not bear the burden of FedEx's mistake. They seem willing to reship the goods to me. Not on Saturday though, which I can understand. I will let everone know how it turns out.

 

[Anonymous]

Righty, you are right that the tone of the title of this email is maybe too harsh. FedEx is the one who has created this problem in the first instance. My problem is with IPSF and the way they are handling the situation.

...BUT, all is not lost. IPSF and I, after many heated emails back and forth, may yet work something out. IPSF, has agreed that I should not bear the burden of FedEx's mistake. They seem willing to reship the goods to me. Not on Saturday though, which I can understand. I will let everone know how it turns out.

Then please change the title of the thread. IPSF seems to be trying to make this right with you, yet this thread is clearly bashing them.

 

[dragon0121]

No, leave the title just the way it is. IPSF was not willing to make it right, they had to be pressured to make it right. Big difference. Threads like this can exert a lot of pressure on mail order reef companies. If IPSF had been taken at their word, right from the start, Rook would have paid for an order he never received a shipment for, and IPSF would have walked with his money. Rook chose to pursue his complaint vigorously, and other can learn from this, including businesses like IPSF. As a consumer, it's your money, and you should guard it jealously!

 

[Rook]

Righty, you are right that the tone of the title of this email is maybe too harsh. FedEx is the one who has created this problem in the first instance. My problem is with IPSF and the way they are handling the situation.

...BUT, all is not lost. IPSF and I, after many heated emails back and forth, may yet work something out. IPSF, has agreed that I should not bear the burden of FedEx's mistake. They seem willing to reship the goods to me. Not on Saturday though, which I can understand. I will let everone know how it turns out.

Then please change the title of the thread. IPSF seems to be trying to make this right with you, yet this thread is clearly bashing them.

Can I do that??? If so How???

If IPSF does work this out with me I would gladly change it to something not so harsh.

 

[Anonymous]

Just go to your first post and hit edit. The title is right there as an editable item.

 

[Minh Nguyen]

There are several important point, IMO, that need to point out here:

1. Rook did not make any mistake.
2. Rook have to eat the 100 dollars because some one else mistake. There is only one persom who can make claims to recover some or all of the 100 dollars lost. That is IPSF.
3. IPSF does not care that Rook out of 100 dollars. They got their 100 dollars for the shipment that they send out and that is all they care.

That is why IPSF is wrong in this case. Only they can make a claim, they won't because it is too much trouble, and I suspect because they will not gain anything from it. That is only Rook will get refund for any trouble IPSF go into to get the refund.

While the customer is not alway right, as a business who wanted repeat customers, IPSF should make better effort to take care of their customer. If, in IPSF's opinion, that FedEx is a bad shipper, then they should choose another carrier. IPSF choose FedEx, which make several mistakes, and wanted Rook to pay for it. Yet IPSF make no effort at helping Rook recover his lost money. I am sorry but in my book IPSF is wrong in this case. If this is truely how IPSF treat their customer, then they will not get another dollar from me. I have ordered from IPSF before, but will not order again unless IPSF show that what I think happened did not happen, or they send another package to Rook to replace the one that was lost due the whole fisasco.

Minh Nguyen

 

[Anonymous]

1. Rook did not make any mistake.

It was his call that caused the package to not be delivered, so I think he bears some of the blame.

Hey, I just noticed something- reefers are really anal-retentive!