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AllenF

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Marrowbone":3bze3at7 said:
It's possible a tiny open cut on his finger could've killed him. 8O

8O

How horrible that would be! I bet the physicians wouldnt even have had a clue what happened to him...it would have looked like he just spontaneously arrested.

Would be quite intresting if we were talking about somthing here that replaced Botulism as the deadlist toxin known to man kind...they would have to rewrite the text books...
 

Reefguide

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I see no reason why everyone is hanging out to dry and in some cases flat out accusing him of being a liar.... Maybe it did pierce the skin and wasn't noticable...

AllenF I think your dove off the deep end there with a few of your comments...
 

AllenF

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I didnt mean it that way. I am just amazed that none of these topics ever came up in college microbiology, physiology, chemistry, pathophysiology, pharmocology, etc. I only graduated in 95.

It would be intresting to go back and take some Marine biology courses in order to audit the literature on these topics.

Are their any texts or research papers published about this?

I never questioned the sequence of events in any fashion! I merely mentioned the possiblity of alternative or perhaps synergistic underlying causes of the signs and symptoms.

Just because a person has a close call does not automatically assume every piece of information obtained from that person is 100% correct.

An objective person examines ALL OF THE POSSIBILITIES. If physicians followed your suggestions we would be treating ailments like "Ernie tripped and it made me have a heart attack" as if that was what really triggered the chest pain :roll:

Again, I didnt question his honesty or the sequence of events...just the interpretation of the causative agent. After 8 years of taking care of patients I have learned this as a habit. You would be surprised at the things people assume "caused" their problem. You would also be surprised at how coincedental the timing seems to be in relation to the onset of symptoms for some of the cases.

The rest of the info on botulism digoxin etc etc can be referenced in college texts on the subjects. (not sure which comments I made that were so far off the "deep end")

As a matter of a fact, I do believe him. If I didnt I wouldnt have bothered in posting at all.

I just have a genuine professional intrest in what type of properties these substances have. You would be surprised where drugs come from. You have probably heard of a blood thinner called heparin , but did you know the antidote to heparin (protamine sulfate) is a derivative of salmon sperm?

Dont be critical of a guy for being curious.
 

esmithiii

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"Ernie tripped and it made me have a heart attack" as if that was what really triggered the chest pain

AllenF- Are you now accusing ME of wrongdoing??!? ;) ;)

IMO asking these types of questions is important to getting to the root cause of an event like this.

In any case, I will definitely be more careful handling things in my tank from now on.

Ernie
 

wombat1

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I'm definitely no nudi expert, but here's what I've gathered from someone who knows a lot about them:
Incidentally, these nudi's are some of the coolest animals around. They are capable of keeping the cnytocytes (stinging cells) of the cnidarians that they prey upon in an unfired state. The cnytocytes then travel to the orange "gill" portion of the nudibranch as a form of protection.
He (Bleeding Blue at RDO) is referring to a hydroid eating nudibranch, but I see no reason why a zoanthid eating nudibranch couldn't do the same thing. Granted, the "sting" of a zoanthid is mild at best, but many concentrated cnidocytes might be able to get into the skin. Just a possible avenue of getting the toxin into his body. Also, a cut wouldn't have to be on his finger. If his whole arm was in the aquarium when the nudibranch was squished, the toxin could get in anywhere.
 

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