Siphon Overflow Myths?

[Bone]

I've used a Lifereef overflow for over two years and I haven't had a single problem. If you have it set up right it is fairly quiet. They do need to be cleaned every few months.

One drawback with external overflow is that they create a perfect site for salt creep to form.

 

[jandree22]

Okay, just got emailed back from the Marine Bio at That Fish Place, where I got my tank from. He said the sides of my 75 aren't tempered, so therefore I can get it drilled. This of course means I have to lug the 150lb beast out of the in-wall shelf, upstairs outa the basement, into the back of my parent's Trailblazer, into a glass shop, and then everything in reverse. How much should I expect to pay to get the side drilled? Obviously I know it'd cost more, but do you think it's possible to find a glass cutter that'll do a house call? I definately would like to get my tank drilled, but is there any particularly easy way to get it done?

Thanks,
Joel

 

[xrunner123]

Xrunner-

OK, so the tank doesn't overflow because you have a tiny sump, but your return pump does burn up from running dry. This is somehow not a problem?

Bottom line is I feel safe with my reef-ready tank. I didn't with my overflow box. I ran the overflow box over a year without a problem until one day boom, overflow. I cleaned everything out and two days later wet carpet, pissed off wife. Never again.

Ernie

Like I said before, rely on physics. It IS better to have the tank drilled, I never said it wasn't, but if you can't have it drilled or your tank is set up without a sump and you want to add one, there is nothing wrong with going with an overflow provided you do everything to ensure failsafe operation.

What kind of overflow did you have? What is the crappy CPR with the hole in the head? The lifereefs are so much better and I don't get why alot of the online fish stores just sell the CPRs and don't offer both or just get rid of the CPR. Bad design by far.

The lifereef dual tube overflow is self clearing of air bubbles and will restart on a loss of pump power. Since there are 2 tubes you have sort of a redundancy, so if you lose 1 you can still somewhat run on the other one. I did lose flow on one of the tubes in almost 2 years of operation and that was because I was lazy on cleaning the tube.

Now you are right, if you totally lose overflow, you will burn a pump. That is why drilling a tank IS better, BUT if you design you sump and overflow setup properly there is NOTHING wrong with the hang-on overflows. Just go with the Lifereef and stay away from the ones (CPR) that rely on a powerhead to restart siphon.

Now you can also flood with a drilled tank if you sump is too small and you get a pump failure or power outage, so be smart people and do a power outage test and a loss of siphon test. If you can flood you are asking for a disaster down the road.

 

[jandree22]

is there any way that you can rig your sump to cut power to a pump if the water level gets too low, for the purpose of saving the pump?

 

[Anonymous]

is there any way that you can rig your sump to cut power to a pump if the water level gets too low, for the purpose of saving the pump?

Sure. You can put the pump on a float switch.

 

[xrunner123]

is there any way that you can rig your sump to cut power to a pump if the water level gets too low, for the purpose of saving the pump?

Yes, float switch as suggested. Very good idea.

 

[Anonymous]

To the original poster,
What it comes down to is eliminating as many potential disasters as possible. You'd be suprised at how much even 5 gallons of water turns out to be once it's on the floor.

Jim

 

[Chucker]

To the original poster,
What it comes down to is eliminating as many potential disasters as possible. You'd be suprised at how much even 5 gallons of water turns out to be once it's on the floor.

Jim

Or coming through the neighbor's ceiling downstairs.

 

[jandree22]

To the original poster,
What it comes down to is eliminating as many potential disasters as possible. You'd be suprised at how much even 5 gallons of water turns out to be once it's on the floor.

Jim

Or coming through the neighbor's ceiling downstairs.

yikes! I couldn't imagine 8O

 

[jandree22]

so I just got to thinking... everyone's bashing overflows with the potential that a snail will clog up the siphon and stop the flow to the sump. however, wouldn't it be just as easy for a snail to climb over an internal overflow and clog up the bulkhead in the glass causing the same problem? :?

 

[Anonymous]

If it comes down to having a hang on overflow, I will just go sumples.

As long as everything is working properly they are fine, but if something is shooting airbubbles in the tank, or algae builds up in the tube and you get behind on keeping it clean, or various other little things can happen and you loose siphon, you end up sopping water out of the rug.

Or in my case my old fashioned in the floor furnace filled up with salt water.

 

[xrunner123]

If it comes down to having a hang on overflow, I will just go sumples.

As long as everything is working properly they are fine, but if something is shooting airbubbles in the tank, or algae builds up in the tube and you get behind on keeping it clean, or various other little things can happen and you loose siphon, you end up sopping water out of the rug.

Or in my case my old fashioned in the floor furnace filled up with salt water.

Read one of my above responses. If you flood in this condition it is a bad sump design.

 

[Anonymous]

Just go with the Lifereef and stay away from the ones (CPR) that rely on a powerhead to restart siphon.

CPR overflows don't rely on the pump (you don't have to use a powerhead) to restart the siphon, it never breaks, if you understand how it works. Never had a problem with mine, except a rogue lobster who decided the intake was his new home.

So what happens when the power goes out and your beloved lifereef breaks the siphon then? FLOOD

The CPR uses a pump to keep the siphon free of air(all of the time), so when the power comes back on, no worries. I use the aqualifter pump to clear the siphon, never one problem.

 

[xrunner123]

Just go with the Lifereef and stay away from the ones (CPR) that rely on a powerhead to restart siphon.

CPR overflows don't rely on the pump (you don't have to use a powerhead) to restart the siphon, it never breaks, if you understand how it works. Never had a problem with mine, except a rogue lobster who decided the intake was his new home.

So what happens when the power goes out and your beloved lifereef breaks the siphon then? FLOOD

The CPR uses a pump to keep the siphon free of air(all of the time), so when the power comes back on, no worries. I use the aqualifter pump to clear the siphon, never one problem.

Oh sorry, yes they are not needed to restart siphon, they are needed to prevent the buildup of air bubbles- my bad. And you NEED the powerhead to get rid of the air bubbles or you will loose siphon eventually.

The reason that they need the powerhead to suck out the air is because of the wide overflow. The velocity of the water in not enough to drag the bubbles down and out. The design that Lifereef and others have, use the best geometry for the U-tubes. The velocity is high and it will overcome any airbubble in the stream.

I had a CPR and I threw it out after 6 months of use. I lost suction once because of a powerhead failure and another time due to a clogged airline.
Not worth the aggravation

So what happens when the power goes out and your beloved lifereef breaks the siphon then? FLOOD

Impossible to FLOOD. My sump won't allow it.

From the sound of it, you like your CPR. I'm glad it work's for you. But I guarentee you will like the dual Lifereef overflow. Flows so much more easier to clean, and is overall a better design. I had both, so I know.

 

[esmithiii]

so I just got to thinking... everyone's bashing overflows with the potential that a snail will clog up the siphon and stop the flow to the sump. however, wouldn't it be just as easy for a snail to climb over an internal overflow and clog up the bulkhead in the glass causing the same problem? :?

The snail would have to climb out of the water to get in my overflow.

In my case, I use a modified durso standpipe, and the only snail small enough to get inside would not restrict the flow to my sump.

A couple of points- A syphon is easy to break; air bubbles, any clog or disturbance can cause it to stop functioning. A standpipe would have to be completely clogged to not work.

 

[Enzo]

for not burning out the pump couldn't you just have either a 90 degree elbow where the outake is so that whenever it runs out the water just falls right back down. What would be a safety for your pump not to burn out?

 

[xrunner123]

for not burning out the pump couldn't you just have either a 90 degree elbow where the outake is so that whenever it runs out the water just falls right back down. What would be a safety for your pump not to burn out?

Jandree22 had mentioned a float valve to cut off pump.

 

[liquid]

FYI to the people on the thread: I created a survey about overflow failures. You can take the poll here: http://reefs.org/GBSurvey/surveyq.php?survey_id=13

Shane

 

[dtiedke]

I have a overflow that I made custom for my tank. I feel that with proper upkeep, they can be reliable.

However, I do have my sump on two different floats each for high water and low water alarms. For high water, my auto-topoff shuts down. For low water, my skimmer turns off (giving me a couple of gallons) then my refuge pump turns off (giving me a few more gallons) and my return pump is set to a on/off cycle of 1 minute on, 5 minutes off until the system is reset. This would buy me some time to get home and fix the situation while still providing some circulation in the tank.

Oh, and either condition will result in an instant page sent to my phone, as well as an email to my wife, my self, and my friend who has a key to my home.

I feel that the best equipment I have bought is the AquaController II and a ton of X-10 modules, relays, sensors etc.... Helps me sleep at night and leave my home without much worry....

my $.02 anyway....


Dave

P.S. They do make "water-on-floor" sensors in a variety of types for those who are really paranoid....

 

[esmithiii]

I have a overflow that I made custom for my tank. I feel that with proper upkeep, they can be reliable.

However, I do have my sump on two different floats each for high water and low water alarms. For high water, my auto-topoff shuts down. For low water, my skimmer turns off (giving me a couple of gallons) then my refuge pump turns off (giving me a few more gallons) and my return pump is set to a on/off cycle of 1 minute on, 5 minutes off until the system is reset. This would buy me some time to get home and fix the situation while still providing some circulation in the tank.

Oh, and either condition will result in an instant page sent to my phone, as well as an email to my wife, my self, and my friend who has a key to my home.

I feel that the best equipment I have bought is the AquaController II and a ton of X-10 modules, relays, sensors etc.... Helps me sleep at night and leave my home without much worry....

my $.02 anyway....


Dave

P.S. They do make "water-on-floor" sensors in a variety of types for those who are really paranoid....

A pre-drilled tank eliminates so many variables, and simplifies the situation enormously. I can't imagine adding an AquaController and X-10 modules to be cheaper than having a reef-ready tank to begin with.

Ernie