Big Crash

[jlinderman]

I have a question for the experienced member in this community.

I have a large (1000 gal) reef tank that has been running nicely for over 5 years. I have been paying a service to perfrom maintenance on this tank. I was happy until recently my entore tank crashed. First the refugium tank overflowed causing water to escape - this caused the chiller to freeze and crack - which then caused the condensor to short out - the water then rose to over 90 degrees causing all of the corals to die, and many fish. In the process I lost several thousand dollars of investment. Most importantly everything I was trying so hard to grow I watched die. Very depressing.

It took my tank service over 2 weeks to address these issues.

My question is - do reef services ever take responsibility for problems caused by their actions? If not I really wonder the value beyond simple maintenance.

I am now considering a new service, but next time I want to manage expectations better.

 

[NYreefNoob]

Well If Your Sump Overflowed, Then I Doubt It Was Their Fault. Or Better Yet What Caused It To Overflow ?

 

[LeslieS]

It took my tank service over 2 weeks to address these issues.

Did it take two weeks to resolve the issue or two weeks to begin working on the issues?

 

[Tonyscoots84]

I guess there are so many things that can go wrong. if it was a setup issue which he had done then yes it is his fault if something went wrong because of it but if he did not set it up that way how could it be his fault

 

[jlinderman]

Thanks or the questions. I can offer some answers - Regarding the refugium that overflowed - The tank guy recommended this and installed it. But he forgot to put a cap on the overflow - the algea grew on the inside and plugged it up. AS such the water simply poured over the top until the sump ran dry. This is what caused the chiller to freeze over and crack - then more water leaked out. This whole thing happened in the course of 1 day. When I found the problem it took the service guy 2 weeks to get the system back up and running.

I am still in a state of mourning!

 

[boozeman]

What does the contract you signed say about equipment failure ect. ?

 

[jlinderman]

I never signed a formal contract so I suspect I have no other avenue other than firing the group.

Anybody have a recommendation for service guys in Wilton, CT area?

 

[jackson6745]

http://www.greenwichaquaria.com/

 

[marki24]

My theory is that if you cannot take care of something yourself then its not for you. Sorry to hear about the loss good luck second time around. And i give your props for not giving up ( i probably would given up by then)

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

Sorry for your lost. Can you show a pic of the overflow that clogged up?

Some how I got a feeling that the initial design seems to be faulted.

I did not hear you said about water alarm, controller and such. Most medium to large systems like this should have some kind of fault tolerance build into the design. Did the chiller back siphon? Is there controller to turn off the heat generating stuff when the temperature is getting too high......?

A lot of the times, service company may not be knowledgeable enough to tell there are faults in the design to begin with.

 

[rookie07]

My theory is that if you cannot take care of something yourself then its not for you. Sorry to hear about the loss good luck second time around. And i give your props for not giving up ( i probably would given up by then)

I disagree completely......does that mean that every person who has a lawn, and pays a landscaper should not have a lawn.....
How about a pool......I dont know one person in the northeast who takes care of their own pool......Do you go to a mechanic for your car? there are so many more examples...but you get the point.

A comment like that actually angers me...i dont know why, but it does.


and...in my eyes...the person who started this tank was taking better care of his/her tank than most of us, b/c they have an (in theory)experianced/knowledgable aquarist looking after their tank...unlike most of us who are fairly inexperianced in this hobby.

 

[KuyaMark]

in my honest opinion, it's not there fault.....If I were you I would learn how to run my system and how everything goes, so just in case something goes wrong you know
the in's and out of your tank. And also the Joy you get that you yourself took care of your own reef and watch everything grow is priceless!!

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

I never signed a formal contract so I suspect I have no other avenue other than firing the group.

Anybody have a recommendation for service guys in Wilton, CT area?

Firing the the group should not be treated as a recourse but a smarter move to find a more knowledgeable company who can analysis your system or foresee your problems. No one can really be 100% perfect but some are more intuitive to spotting potential problems.

 

[rookie07]

in my honest opinion, it's not there fault.....If I were you I would learn how to run my system and how everything goes, so just in case something goes wrong you know
the in's and out of your tank. And also the Joy you get that you yourself took care of your own reef and watch everything grow is priceless!!

I agree almost completely....it is the company's fault...but there is nothing you can do aside from finding someone else to take care of the tank....there was a great link listed above(thats what Ive heard, i have no personal experiance with GA)

 

[tinyreef]

My theory is that if you cannot take care of something yourself then its not for you.

i disagree, he was paying the maintenance company a caboodle of money to make sure the tank looked pretty and the setup was as fail-safe as possible (that's implicit imho).

like aqua pro mentioned, flood alarms or maybe even UPS setups should've been incorporated in a setup like that (i.e. 1000g setups aren't 'run of the mill'). i'm hearing a lot of hardware (and $$$) but not a lot of thought from the mintenance company.

whether they're 100% at fault or not is difficult to say with the limited amount of information and the source of it (no offense, linderman). but should the maintenance company be somewhat responsible or be pleading for their continued employment? i would think so. just my $0.02

 

[daisy]

I'm really sorry for your losses - both of life and of money.

You seem to be "serious" in this hobby in your own way - while most of the folks on this board are do-it-yourself-ers in one way shape or form, you enjoy the reef, the life in it, and give the maintenance job to others - and that is totally fine (not really addressing you, addressing the rest of us) -- we all do it our own way. I, for example, am good with the biology of my tank, good with lots of theory, but pretty much suck at the plumbing (which is tough to get around....)

That said, if you did not sign any contract, then I think the folks who maintain your system are not technically bound to anything. If there was a verbal understanding, then you might have something, but you will need to speak with a lawyer.

All that said, I agree that a 1000-gal system is a huge endeavor, but the folks on this board can help you with advice, and some of them are even for hire!!!! You've found a great site and a great community, and I hope that not only don't you give up, but you decide to get even more involved in your piece of the ocean.

Best of luck!

 

[jayuws]

I'm not sure if this will help but if I were you I'd take as many pictures as possible of your entire setup, all damages, and loss of property (ie. livestock). If you had an agreement with this company and paid them they should have something stating exactly what they are responsible for. I would find out if the service company is insured. I would also file a claim with my homeowners insurance. Finally if you believe you had an agreement (written or verbal) that this company would fully take care of your system and they did not comply with this agreement I would take them to small claims. But if their job was only to clean your tank you would have to prove that they did not do their job.

As a homeowner, I do not let anyone in my home to service anything unless they are insured, bonded, and specify exactly what they are going to do.

 

[marki24]

I disagree completely......does that mean that every person who has a lawn, and pays a landscaper should not have a lawn.....
How about a pool......I dont know one person in the northeast who takes care of their own pool......Do you go to a mechanic for your car? there are so many more examples...but you get the point.

A comment like that actually angers me...i dont know why, but it does.


and...in my eyes...the person who started this tank was taking better care of his/her tank than most of us, b/c they have an (in theory)experianced/knowledgable aquarist looking after their tank...unlike most of us who are fairly inexperianced in this hobby.

You are entitled to your anger and i am entitled to my theory :tongue1:

 

[Pinkheine]

My question is - do reef services ever take responsibility for problems caused by their actions? If not I really wonder the value beyond simple maintenance.

I would most certainly think there are reef service companies that take responsibility, and would work with you in restoring things in a timely fashion. Maybe not the one you have had experience working with but like anything there is good and bad service.


Hopefully via this site you will find people to help you get your tank up and running smoothly with no further problems.

From my understanding though even with the most experienced and careful reef keeper, crash is a risk. Unfortunately it happens. Sorry for your losses, may your tank be up running better than ever in the near future.

 

[Sean]

WOW?

A few questions

How often did your service guy come. Once a week once a month twice a week. If he only comes once a month then for the rest of the month it's your problem. It's hard to put him at fault for something he/she isn't around enough for.
How often did the company suggest they should visit the tank for maintenance? If they suggest once a week and you insist on once a month again it's hard to blame them for it.
Did they ever point out things you need or may need to be doing on the days they're not around?
How long before the tragedy did they visit?

I've been doing this for a long time. Sometimes things happen and you stand around looking at the mess, but there should always be a way to come up with a solution that doesn't involve suing each other or taking advantage of each other. Example I have a client that bought a tank that leaked, The company that made it replaced it with another tank that leaked as well. I didn't want a third tank from that company so I had another tank built. All the time I put into tearing down the tanks, setting up new tanks and having temporary tanks there I never charged him for. Not only that the new tank had starfire glass on all four sides and I didn't charge him for the new tank with the upgrade. Now I may have lost thousands in some peoples eyes but I gained a client for life for treating him like gold I get the same respect from him.

I don't know your relationship with your maintenance guy but it should be a harmonious one. The type of relationship that when something like this happens you can come up with some sort of resolution where both don't feel taken advantage of.

Sean