Reef with no CUC... how?

[Levito]

I've always wondered how people pull this off... I see people with reef tanks, with a bunch of non-reef-safe fish, and I wonder how they manage to keep the tank clean without a large CUC. For example, for anyone who's been to Manhattan Aquariums, they have a huge tank right at the front door. I believe there's a good sized trigger and a lunar wrasse in there. Which means no shrimp, no snails, no crabs, or they'd all be a quick snack for these fish. So how do they keep these tanks clean without what I'd consider essential CUC members?

 

[Loer]

GREAT QUESTION!... (that is a beautiful tank right there in the front when you come in, on the left hand side)

 

[Jkedra]

GREAT QUESTION!... (that is a beautiful tank right there in the front when you come in, on the left hand side)

Definitely an amazing tang...was also wondering the same thing.

 

[Jkedra]

I would think that the people at that place clean and maintain it.

 

[jf2381]

I was running with no clean up crew until my wife over fed my tank for two weeks and now I have hair algae. Sooo I had to place an order for a large cuc.

 

[TRIGGERMAN]

Lots of rock, it's that simple.

 

[tommy1618]

really, rock and no cleaners? i have about 200+ lr, shouldnt need cleaners?

 

[jf2381]

I should add that I dose MB7 and biofuel.

 

[tosiek]

Lots of rock, it's that simple.

Rock does not clean your tank. All it does is provide area for bacteria to colonize and maintain your organic waste cycle helping to balance the breakdown of the waste. It doesn't clean your tank of fish poop, algae buildup on the glass, any detritus or food waste, or clean itself of any buildup or growth. Po4 and No3 need to be controlled by water changes, alot of siphoning and scrubbing, and Po4 removing media for those tanks to be successful.

Manhattan Aquariums does alot of hand maintenance in that tank. I've seen it on days where it needed a little TLC and a good scrub. Not having a cucumber or clean up crew means you will be doing alot of that work yourself, thats all that that means. There is no magic trick people are performing.

More rocks actually mean you will be cleaning more as your adding alot more space and low flow areas where waste IS building up and causing your tank to have nigher trates and Po4.

 

[ming]

You could simply gravel vac your sandbed with every water change

 

[PhoenixOne]

Lots of rock, it's that simple.

Still scratching my head on that one....

But anyway, in regards to vacuuming your live sand, I've read that would release toxins into the water column....thoughts?

 

[reefman]

u should only vacuum the thin top layer only if its even necessary.

 

[TRIGGERMAN]

Rock in the sump.. your sump and rock is your filter..that's what an overflow is for most of the crap gets caught in your sock/pads and the bacteria does the rest. The more rock the more bacteria the more bacteria the better filtration it's not rocket science.

 

[marrone]

Rock in the sump.. your sump and rock is your filter..that's what an overflow is for most of the crap gets caught in your sock/pads and the bacteria does the rest. The more rock the more bacteria the more bacteria the better filtration it's not rocket science.

I think you're getting confused here, more LR gives you more bacteria, which in turn lets you handle a much larger load in the tank. What it doesn't do it clean the tank of all the garbage that a CUC would. Yes, some would be trapped by a filter sock but a lot would get caught under the LR and in corners of the tank. You would either need a CUC to help remove it or siphon it out yourself during water changes.

 

[tosiek]

yeah your right that it helps filter the tank but your not seeing the whole story on what needs to be filtered in the tank. Your missing something Trigger.

 

[jf2381]

Rock does not clean your tank. All it does is provide area for bacteria to colonize and maintain your organic waste cycle helping to balance the breakdown of the waste. It doesn't clean your tank of fish poop, algae buildup on the glass, any detritus or food waste, or clean itself of any buildup or growth. Po4 and No3 need to be controlled by water changes, alot of siphoning and scrubbing, and Po4 removing media for those tanks to be successful.

Manhattan Aquariums does alot of hand maintenance in that tank. I've seen it on days where it needed a little TLC and a good scrub. Not having a cucumber or clean up crew means you will be doing alot of that work yourself, thats all that that means. There is no magic trick people are performing.

More rocks actually mean you will be cleaning more as your adding alot more space and low flow areas where waste IS building up and causing your tank to have nigher trates and Po4.

Agree one hundred percent.
It was evident in my reef when I was absent 2 straight weeks. I was not around to do water changes, dose and and perform maintenance. So the tank suffered.

 

[lfsmarineguy]

Bacteria like any living thing requires a food source. The amount of rock in the tank can reach a point of diminishing returns, where you have more rock than is really necessary to support a colony of bacteria that will sufficiently filter the tank. As Tosiek, said the more rock you have the more areas for detritus to settle and cause nutrient pockets. Store tanks are amazing most of the time because there is someone there to keep them clean all day every day not to mention that there is usually a skilled person or group behind its success.

As for siphoning the gravel, it really only matters in a deep sand bed which most people do not have. In a shallow (anything under 4") sand bed you do have a fauna population and siphoning does disturb them. If you break the sand bed up into sections, say quarters or even eighths, and just siphon that small section during any one water change than you aren't creating a catastrophic deficit in your beneficial populations, by allowing the other portions of undisturbed sand to repopulate.

 

[PhoenixOne]

As for siphoning the gravel, it really only matters in a deep sand bed which most people do not have. In a shallow (anything under 4") sand bed you do have a fauna population and siphoning does disturb them. If you break the sand bed up into sections, say quarters or even eighths, and just siphon that small section during any one water change than you aren't creating a catastrophic deficit in your beneficial populations, by allowing the other portions of undisturbed sand to repopulate.

Thanks Jared:thrash:

 

[spike915]

Just because your adding more rock doesnt mean your adding more bacteria. The food supply available to the bacteria dictates how much bacteria will grow. Research stuff before you speak Triggerman

 

[TRIGGERMAN]

Well when you are talking about turds last I checked snails and hermits didn't eat fish turds. They'll eat leftover food yea but some of that stuff is going to get stuck anyway regardless of how much CUC you have. Unless of course you take out all your rocks and dismantle your entire reef every time you do a water change and rinse every rock. What about all the turds from the snails and hermits themselves? EXACTLY! Don't get me wrong like I said I do a light siphoning because I have bare bottom and I can do that. When you have sand it does more bad then good. Siphoning it stirs everything up and makes a mess releasing all the nitrate and phosphate trapped below like I said earlier. Sand being so fine moves around a lot from the fish, critters digging, you moving a rock, whatever. Stuff gets trapped in the sand bed all day long. Having lots of rock helps to cancel out the EFFECTS that detritus and what not has on the tank. That bacteria is able to break down that waste minimizing the nutrient levels that cause nitrates and phosphates as well as algae growth. There might be some crap trapped in your rocks but it won't make your levels go crazy,or have insane algae outbreaks taking over the tank. Hence keeping it "clean". That's the point I was trying to make.

Spike, perhaps you should research the English language and learn proper punctuation? It's "you're" as in YOU ARE.."your" indicates ownership.