Problems finding new wholesaler

[JennM]

Interesting discussion

With regard to the GA Dept of Agriculture, yes it is a state matter, and it's a state inspector that comes to check the premesis.

I've had one experience with such an inspector, and she actually asked the owner if these were proper conditions for the animals he was keeping (DUH....like he's going to say no!?).

I think he got written up for not having a fire extinguisher (which he bought, and he was re-inspected and passed).

Like Rover mentioned, most often the inspectors are more versed in farm animals, dogs, cats and birds. I don't think the inspector we saw even realized how many sessile animals she was looking at in our tanks, or what their needs are.

Some inspection is better than no inspeciton, I suppose, but it would be more effective if the inspectors were at least given a few criteria to watch for.

Jenn

 

[Bill2]

I've just read the thread and have watched as it has gone through it's twists and turns.

Yes, good retail shops need to be protected. They have deicated time and money to become a good shop.

Yes, most of the time you get better fish/corals that have been cared out of home based businessess.

So what do we do?

If I was setting up a wholesale facility I think I would require these things.
1. Biz License
2. Photos of setup. Mainly to see they are serious about trying this and just don't have a single tank they are going to sell out of. Should be easy in this day and age of digi cams
3. Minimum order of $100
4. Minimum monthy order of $400 (or whatever is avg) If you miss 2 out of 3 months you are "banned" for a year.

It seems like that would A) protect the store fronts by creating store like minimums and B) insure the home based biz is really looking to sell stuff not just stock his/her tank cheaply.

 

[MFisher]

I know how blowfishaq feels. I've tried to set up a small home based buisness selling reef stuff exclusively and possibly a few tank maintainance gigs but I've been snowballed by retailers. I'd open a big one if I was done with grad school. The fact is that no one within 100 miles sells corals, those within 150 miles are so/so and local reefers still make the drive quite a bit. I think it sucks.

 

[cubera]

Wow......BRYAN: Send me and Email off this DB and we'll "talk".....

 

[ajx22]

I can agree with the frustration of TRYING to purchase without a "Brick and Morter" STOREFRONT.

In Canada, the list of DECENT, KNOWLEDGEABLE retailers is very short. I have been a hobbiest searching for a decent place to shop for a very long time...and after talking to a lot of other people having the same problem - I decided to open my own business - providing what I had been looking for, and what continued to be missing.

It's bad enough that the initial set-up costs for a PROPER Marine Aquarium supply company is so great (equipment) even if you were to set-up a GARAGE based company. To set-up a true "RETAIL" location is exactly what I DON'T want - as I then fall into the same situation as other LFS. It's the costs associated with running a RETAIL business that have this industry charging the prices that it does for equipment - "JUST TO PAY THE BILLS"!! (If you set-up a RETAIL location...you have to pay for 2-months rent, and water, and electricity, and... while you wait for your tanks to cycle so you can put livestock in the tank. Then there are the companies that just set it up and open the same day too. Hmmm...and you wonder why a lot of the LFS have poor quality. You wouldn't believe how many LFS here in Toronto don't even use RO/DI in their tanks). If you have a smaller, more manageable company - then you can focus on what SHOULD be important - THE ANIMALS!!!

It has taken some time, but I have found the wholesalers that are true to the ANIMALS and not to the INDUSTRY...and those are the ones I will continue to deal with. I will have an Internet and Brick storefront - except my Internet store will be the only one that looks nice as I'm getting a warehouse that will support the needs of numerous tanks and filtration - not pleasing to the eye.

Just my 2-cents worth - had to RANT as this whole "INDUSTRY" seems to TRY to work backwards. Either WE adjust the way WE run this industry - or we can just keep it running the way it is...All for the $$$$$$ - and then look back on "The Days" when we could. Soon it will be go to "That Guy" on the corner to get some "weed" and a new "coral"; and avoid the cops on the way home!!

I agree 100% with "Bill2"s ideas.
When customers order livestock from me...I ask questions as to their set-up and their knowledge of the said animal(s). If either aren't up to par...I SELL THEM A BOOK!!!

[ January 22, 2002: Message edited by: AJ ]</p>

 

[Oldguy]

flameangle

To all of you who have garage and basement "businesses"--
We who are "storefronts" have to pay Business insurance-rent-state registrations, licenses, phone book listings, SALES TAX,higher rates for electricity and heating products,and have many more "legal business" overhead costs.
We also maintain parking lots in all weather, are required to have regular business hours,have far more accounting practices,get untold time involved with every salesman around for anything,
and most of us "do not own the business-the business OWNS us "!!

First I understand your feeling towards homebased business but you cannot lumb us all togeather.
1. I pay business insurance ( I still need to protect things same as you)
2. I have to follow the same state registrations, licenses.
3. I pay SALES TAX
4. I have alot of the same legal business overhead cost.
I do on rent, save some on electricity and yes no parking lots to maintain
I have decided on a cell phone in lew of a land line.
I have owned a LFS and plan on opening again in the furture but now is not the time. This area is just to depressed.
Now is my business hurting the local LFS.
NO the closest saltwater store that people go to is the sameone that I go to when I need something and don't need enough place a order. Yes they know that I have a business.
The closest Freshwater we work togeather so that we dont hurt each other we also pool our drygood order from time to time.
I get off my soap box now. With one parting though If you have a problem with a homebase business you might see if you can help them it may put $ in your pocket it did mine.

 

[Anonymous]

One reason for this rule (store front) that hasn't been mentioned is store fronts buy from the wholesalers entire list regularly where as home based businesses typically buy cream of the crop aka cherry pick. If you don't have the cherrys, and just bread and butter, you'll loose orders. Now if you regulate those cherrys, spread them out, you won't loose those orders. One way off heading that off before it even becomes a problem is to cut out the main cherry pickers, garage based businesses. I know there are exceptions. Store fronts order consistantly and usually diverse. They depend on all sales, big and small. Wholesalers too, depend on sales, consistant sales. I know garege based businesses depend on sales too, but it's fare less than store fronts. Wholesalers in any trade, aren't on the business of ones and twos, they're in the business of mass sales, period. In a lot of other trades, the wholesalers require similiar things from their buyers, its nothing new or unusual.

That rule should apply to etailers and too IMO. Store fronts run this trade. They advertise, get good locations and activelly try to bring people into the hobby. I live in the bay area, I'm REALLY active in the hobby and I don't even know where those garage based bussinesses mentioned earlier are. I never heard of ANY around here. Why? Because they don't advertise. I couldn't even be a "walk-in" customer who stumbled off the street, lured by the fish, because they don't have store fronts. The general mass of people in this trade aren't online. They learned about the trade from store fronts, brought in buy advertising, word of mouth or just stumbled across the aquarium store.[/b]

 

[MaryHM]

Gresham,

Right on!! I don't even allow local retail store front owners into my warehouse for that exact reason- they want to take all of the cherry stuff and go buy the bread and butter cheaper elsewhere.

 

[Oldguy]

If a wholesaler cherry picking then who ever buys its does not matter.
A no pick rule that is great.
Your not knowing of any garege based businesses may be where you live.
Here there is 1 store that carrys SW in 25 miles they have about 200 gallons of water there and no one that knows anything.
To get to a store with a good rep and stock its close to 60 miles a hour and half drive.
Now myself I have over 400 gallons of saltwater running.
To open a store will my business grow yes will it grow to enough to cover cost of start up I dont think it would.
True I do not order as often as when we had a LFS. Does that make me any different than a storefront with 100 of SW?
As for advertising word of mouth is still the best.
A coulpe of well placed free tanks have done more than anything else we have tried.

 

[Bryan Thompson]

Wow, this thread has lasted over a year now. The problem is still the same. Storefronts hate startups. It is just that simple. I can see both sides. This will never change. The problem is when the wholesaler joins the fight and picks sides. As a supplier you need to remain neutral.

For the wholesalers that picked sides and put restrictions like ads in phonebooks, sorry but you lost my business. My average wholesale purchase is about $1,500 to 2,000 a month now. That is 18-24,000 a year in sales. This number is growing and will continue.

The whole point here is as follows:

The fight has always been between storefront and home business. Lets keep it that way and the wholesalers should remain neutral.

Bryan

 

[Anonymous]

Old Guy, I was referring Terra Ferma's post earlier in this thread:

"Garage operations are where I get the best and healthiest livestock from, fish or coral. To boot, the only places in my area (SF Bay Area)that carry more advanced reef keeping drygoods are garage operations."

Location isn't the problem, theres probably around 30 full aquarium stores in 100 radious. I travel all around. When I worked retail, the other fish room people and I visitted different stores every weekend. The management encouraged it. Theres still ones I haven't been to. I think the problem is that the garege based businesses around here are "under ground". I can dig it, kinda like a secret club 8) . A new quest for me, find the dude whos not only knows were the raves are, but were the garage based fish stores are too :wink: . Is there a map point or an info line?

 

[Krusk]

The fight has always been between storefront and home business. Lets keep it that way and the wholesalers should remain neutral.

Agreed

Every Small Businesses to Every Giant Coporations, they need new customers on daily basic and alway welcome new customers.

Any Business with out new customers will be history.

If I do not treat you well, some one else will.[/quote]


Again, as wholesaler, should remain neutral

 

[Anonymous]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by martynhulyer:
<strong>It's a simalar situation in the UK as mary explained of the wholesaler and retailer.
The wholesale companys here will only deal with you if you have a pet lisence.
The Pet Animals Act 1951 states that: Person keeping a Pet Shop must be licensed.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Is this the same Act that requires Cat, Fish and Bee Licenses?

"I'd like to get a license for my pet fish, Eric."

you need a half bee license for eric-he had an accident :lol:

'he is an haddock-chose him out o' thousands-isn't like the others, they were all too flat' :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[dawgfish]

WOW, what a great thread...I can see both sides to this argument.

Mary, have you changed your policy on the retail storefront? I saw on your website reefsource.com that *** bought some corals recently and as far as I know *** doesn't have a "retail storefront" as of yet.
:?: :?: :?: :?:

 

[dizzy]

Wow,

Mary he put you on the spot there. Unless he has changed policies, I don't believe *** even allows people to come by and inspect his facilites. I had a friend that wanted to go there, and when he called, *** said sorry no dropping by. Places like that can't even be inspected by the public. In Kentucky if someone complains to the Humane Society about a store, they come out and see if the complaint was justified.

Mitch

 

[MaryHM]

*** recently started buying from us. He is my other salesperson's customer. That salesperson knows the drill for checking out new businesses and I assume he did that. I can't be everywhere at once checking out everything
There are people that slip through. Always have been. It happens because sometimes I don't have enough time to do the research. I can think of 3 customers off the top of my head that slipped through. My general policy is that we only sell to storefronts. But if someone slips through and is a regular customer we don't say "hold on, you can't order now". Believe me, more people get turned away than slip through! We turn away at least 2 a week.

 

[dizzy]

My general policy is that we only sell to storefronts. But if someone slips through and is a regular customer we don't say "hold on, you can't order now". .

Mary,
That sounds a bit like the INS giving amnesty to people who seek in the country illegally. Sounds like you are rewarding the brighter cheaters.

Mitch

 

[Bryan Thompson]

Well Mary I think they have got you on this one. I find it hard to believe you did not know *** was trying to buy from you. The other sales person excuse is a good one. It is right up there with the checks in the mail. Just admit you make exceptions and leave it at that.

Bryan

 

[MaryHM]

This is the last time I'm going to respond to this, because like I stated earlier I do not have to defend my business policies on this board. I am SELF employed, not publicly owned, so what I do is my business.

I did not know that *** ran his operation out of his house. I do not keep up with those things and only visited his website this morning when it was brought to my attention. I spoke with John, my salesperson, and he said that he approved it because of the full page ad in FAMA- he assumed, as would I, that it was a legit retail operation. As far as using "the other salesperson as an excuse", that's crap. Whoever saw *** said they saw it on the See It page of reefsource. Those pages are separated into mine and John's- we each manage our own page. *** was on John's page because he is JOHN'S customer. Get it?

I don't make exceptions knowingly. And even if I did, it's really none of anyone's business how I run my business. Practically every other wholesaler sales to anyone that faxes in a business license without even checking. There are plenty of people who have faxed over licenses from reefs.org and been DENIED. Even after they tell me they purchase from other wholesalers. Again, in every business policies get violated. I am telling you the absolute truth that I do what I can to not sell to home businesses. If you don't want to believe me, that's your perogative. And even if I did sell to home businesses as a general practice (which I don't) nothing is wrong with that. It's not illegal. I just personally don't like to do it.

 

[MaryHM]

And one last obvious thing. This policy does not benefit me financially. Retailers don't buy from me because I don't sell to home business. They're used to wholesalers doing that. In fact, the policy hurts me because there are lots of home based businesses that contact us every month that could be potential customers. I do it because I used to own a retail operation and it was always a pet peeve of mine. So to assume that I'm lying about my policies and I purposefully make exceptions is ludicrous. What would be the point?