Australia Nets Slippery Passenger

[desheriff]

Well you seem to have your on veiw on matters a some what one eyed veiw etc buts thats your right. and assuming what I meant to say?
As to finding good suppliers a little research from others in industry will genrally give info on who good bad or otherwise with regard to quality.

As I have said before those who do the wrong thing dont get re-orders of fish and on the scale of things I would think is a far bigger problem there than here due to shear size of the US market so worry about your own back yard before being so critical of ours.

Regards Steve.

 

[clarionreef]

Good on ya,
NOW ITS A SEARCH FOR QUALITY...in deference to criminality and never mind how it was collected?
YANKS ALWAYS USE THAT ONE TOO.
Welcome to the rest of the world mate,
Oz is becoming like the rest of us.
The criticism of Oz that you imagine is actually a more serious indictment of US.
Steve

 

[clarionreef]

You were hard on the lady smuggler of some plecos and freshwater catfish now.
Its was a strict indictment of criminality, regardless of how token or small.

On the issue of playing ball with the cyanide trade that has laid waste to critical habitat on Bali reefs, Suluwesi reefs , Lombok reefs, Java reefs etc. the theme morphed into one of quality and reputable dealers.

As Aussies tighten up and protect the Great Barrier Reef more from any and all assaults, both real and imagined, they force the fish trade to rely more and more on the criminal imorts of fishes taken illegally abroad.
Taken in a way that the GBRMPA would never allow!
In contrast to the embrace of the illegal trade in poisoned fish the Aussies know better and the lady pleco carrier ment nothing.
Aussies for example know that you can catch all you need with nets...and what kind of nets...and where to get fine mesh monofilament nets to fish legally.
The YANKS DON'T KNOW THIS STUFF. So, they may beg excuse for embracing the cyanide trade. Ignorance is the excuse.
Now how does an Australian collector or dealer play dumb on this?
They know that nets are the answer and always were.
How do they sudenly find no fault with juiced fish?
We hope for help here from youse guys...not compliance with the illegal side of the trade.
Steve

 

[desheriff]

Its not really an indicment of either country boths have problems but leave the crtitising of them out of it
You seem to have a some what jaded veiw of the industry as a whole are you in the right job?
Aquacultured every thing etc is long way off and at the moment in a market place where everything is aout pricing etc as much as people want to be ethical??? if you want survive you have best manage practises you can and make ajustments as you go.
Welcome to a free market place.
Regards Steve

 

[desheriff]

I dont agree with or condone cynjde taking of fish had have never said or eluded to it anything in this thread .
Its a market driven industry with more and more demand being placed upon it you hope and wish that persons do the right thing but they dont and you hope that by not buying from these sourcees they may change but to me and you a dollar is nothing to some who has nothing its a great deal. So education MAC certification etc come in but they still have a long way to go
So perhaps the biggest market place needs to put its money where its mouth is a sponcer more education of the sources.
And I dont import fish and export only .
And I still say that our lady from Singapore did ok if an Australian had got caught doing a simliar crime going in to Singapore I think he or she would be worse of.
Regards Steve

 

[clarionreef]

Jaded view of the industry?
Moi?
It must be the sunglasses.
You mean its clean and legal now?
I had no idea that it got itself refomed somehow.
Steve
Glory be then...I must have missed something.
I gotta go get me some rose colored glasses also.

 

[fishmark]

I just don't get it how people from overseas countries have the ordasity to critise Australias quarintine laws. We have these laws for a reason Australia is an Isolated country Already we have so many introduced pests that have already taken a toll on our natural flora and fauna. If you think Australia is tight try New Zealands livestock import laws there ain't too much different. Everday Australia is faced with who knows how many attempted import and export smugglings. I say good on customs for picking it up. I know of one gentleman who is currently facing charges of smuggling by importing ambionesis shrimp into Australia. He got caught with 20 boxes and deserves everything he gets. Shrimp wether ornamental or food pose a huge risk due to parasites and diseases not found here in Australia. The introduction of a foreign organism could have devastating effects on the environment and economy. One only has to look at the effects of Talapia or even Oscars that are now found in Australia lakes and streams. Hmmm come to think of it alot of introduced pests here in Australia have originated from America Perhaps you should get off your bum and come over and help us clean up your native fish.
Good Work Customs Keep it Up

 

[mkirda]

Good Work Customs Keep it Up

I think the point Steve was trying to make was that making a hobbyist an example trivialized the real problem as he perceives it. There is a difference between someone looking to bring in a few fish for their personal tank (which is what this case is/was understood to be) and someone smuggling in boxes and boxes of various organisms for distribution throughout the various trades.

I have no problems at all with quarantine laws, and while I can understand Steve's point of view (that this is really, really small fry), the fact remains that this person deserves to be treated as the smuggler they are.

Regards.
Mike Kirda

 

[Anonymous]

I like the queen arabesque plecostomus, but not as much as some of the other plecos...it certainly doesn't deserve a high price tag...

Peace,

Chip

 

[Anonymous]

Good Work Customs Keep it Up

I think the point Steve was trying to make was that making a hobbyist an example trivialized the real problem as he perceives it. There is a difference between someone looking to bring in a few fish for their personal tank (which is what this case is/was understood to be) and someone smuggling in boxes and boxes of various organisms for distribution throughout the various trades.

I have no problems at all with quarantine laws, and while I can understand Steve's point of view (that this is really, really small fry), the fact remains that this person deserves to be treated as the smuggler they are.

Regards.
Mike Kirda

what about his view on the 'small fry' cyaniders ? his initial reply to this aussie article seems to be in direct contradiction to his views on the small fryers there (?)

the degree of an offense is either relevant, or it isn't-you can't go pick and choose the relativeness of a crime based on how dear you hold the subject at hand

 

[mkirda]

what about his view on the 'small fry' cyaniders ?

I wouldn't care to comment on Steve's view on this. Steve?

I have had similar conversations with Ferdie a couple of years back.

If you had three fishermen:
1) Strictly nets
2) Strictly cyanide
3) Almost exclusively nets, but may use a squirt bottle now and again for capturing some high-value, but difficult to catch with nets fish.

Obviously #1 is most highly desired.
Would converting #2 into #3 be considered a failure or a partial success?

Personally, I can't help feeling a bit of both.
And don't think that this is some sort of artificial morality test, either.
This result is probably not that uncommon.

Regards.
Mike Kirda

 

[Kalkbreath]

How might opinions change if this was some peices of friut hidden inside the jacket? The same rules apply. Same threats to the enviroment. I even think the penalty is the same for sneeking in plants as for animals.
Does grandma sneeking in some Florida grape fruits warrant the same response as if she wanted to take some plecos back from her vacation?

 

[Anonymous]

yes, she does

 

[Kalkbreath]

What if the same ecological threatening diseases were carried inside grandma not on granny? What if the eliminatory tract of granny was filled with freshly eaten Florida grape fruits[or plecos] Granny isnt picky. If I could prove that most of the same viruses would be dumped into the outback whether they were brought into the country on grandma or in grandma. Would you have the same resolve about protecting the virgin down under? Would you support a quarantine for the visitors to Australia.

 

[Anonymous]

there are many environmental issue raised from international travel, including the spread of many diseases like aids, ebola, etc., which would otherwise not have been spread due to geographical boundaries that are no longer relevant as boundaries


completely different argument, as there DOES happen to be a law against transportin livestock and agriculture internationally unregulated

you break the law, you pay the law

don't like it? change the law (if you can), otherwise, pay if you wanna play

 

[Kalkbreath]

But is there a difference between grandma forgetting that she has an apple in her purse boarding a plane.........and the smuggler that fills a boat with apples and sails across the ocean .
The law is the law.

 

[mkirda]

But is there a difference between grandma forgetting that she has an apple in her purse boarding a plane.........and the smuggler that fills a boat with apples and sails across the ocean .
The law is the law.

This is where the judge looks at the case and the sentencing guidelines, then makes his/her decision. When they have the power, how we feel about it is pretty much irrelevant...

Also, depending on the product being smuggled, there can be different guidelines or different penalties for differing amounts. Think of a guy with a joint vs. a guy with a few bales. Different level of crime.

Regards.
Mike Kirda

 

[Anonymous]

But is there a difference between grandma forgetting that she has an apple in her purse boarding a plane.........and the smuggler that fills a boat with apples and sails across the ocean .
The law is the law.

ever see a stautue of 'lady justice' (the robed woman holding the scales) ?

there's a reason she's wearing a blindfold :wink:

(justice is blind)

 

[fishmark]

Just had an update as regards the smuggling of fish into melbourne, Apparently these fish are worth in excess of $1000 each here in Australia on the black market as they are not a permitted import. And yes the woman in concern is definetly to be charged
Sorry can't reveal the source but can assure it's authenticity

 

[dizzy]

What possible reason would there be for not allowing permits on rare or unsual catfish or plecos. I think smuggling is wrong, but having stupid regulations that aren't based on any form of common sense can lead people to break laws. I used to live in a dry county that didn't allow acohol sales. All this did was create a thriving bootleg business that was totally unregulated. It is much easier for minors to buy acohol in such a system and sales go on 24/7. Not only that but the county is cheating itself out of the tax revenue such sales generate. I guess living is easy when the government makes all your choices for you. Now I understand why you drink so much over there.