First TIME with ICH - HELP

[Thales]

I have been able to find no real support for the idea that garlic does anything to the immune system of a saltwater fish - either fed or dripped into the water. I have looked a lot. There was one that studied garlic on freshwater ich, Ichthyophthirius multifiliis, in petri dishes, but Cryptocaryon irritans is a very different beast - plus what goes on in petri dishes with direct application doesn't necessarily translate to fish eating while swimming in a glass box. Garlic may be an appetite stimulant for fish, it may not, again, no real evidence except 'my fish look like they are eating more'.

Here is some more good reading:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-10/sp/index.php

If anyone has anything that isn't a garlic product manufactures claims, I would love to see it.

 

[Stackbundles]

DAY 5 on Microbe-lift Herbtana. So far the first half of the 10 recommended days is working great. My Yellow Tang an Niger Trigger look ICH FREE. They both are eating great. I will keep you posted.

 

[Thales]

A 10 day a treatment? I don't buy it.

 

[Stackbundles]

That's what it says on the bottle.

 

[IamRobG]

Best of luck stack, it didn't do anything for me. Just keep an eye on your parameters if your skimmer is off. Plus the ICH you see thats gone is because it fell off to breed again, give it 2-3 days it'll be back with a vengeance.

 

[Thales]

I don't believe the bottle. The lifecycle of ich has the white spots being visible for roughly 5-10 days, so they are going to be going away with or without the 'treatment'. With or without the treatment, they might or might not come back, which is what a bunch of the short treatment treatments seem to incorrectly count on as evidence that they actually work.

 

[KathyC]

A 10 day a treatment? I don't buy it.

..and right under the line where it states a 10 day treatment it says...
"In severe cases, a longer treatment period may be required until visible results are achieved'

Considering our OP posted on 2/11 and today is 2/16 his fish are right on schedule to have the Ich fall off the fish and begin to reproduce in his substrate (unfortunately). Herbtana or not, it was going to happen

Stack - how are you addressing keeping your water clean with your skimmer turned off?

 

[Stackbundles]

I did a water change yesterday (5th day) and I will do another one at the end (10th day). I checked all my parameters and everything is fine. So far the only thing about Microbe-lift Herbtana that I don’t like is that the skimmer has to be off.

 

[lo7100]

I finished a full bottle of that a few weeks ago and 2 fishes are dead as a result. I ended up broken down my tank and move all the fishes to QT with copper. In 2 weeks, I can put my fishes back to DT.

 

[Thales]

"ML/Herbtana supports the fish’s immune system, driving off the majority of parasites. Since they cannot return to the fish during treatment, the majority of the parasites will starve without a host."

Even if true (not saying it is), as soon as you stop treatment, after 10 days, fish can be reinfected - thats how the lifecycle of the parasite works. It sits around, encysted, for around 30 days.

 

[Stackbundles]

Can you see ICH in the tank? I may go a few more days with the treatment.

 

[Thales]

 

[Stackbundles]

DAY 10 on Microbe-lift Herbtana.

The good news is that as of rigth now the Ich issue is gone.
The bad news is I lost my Koran Angel. I feel the reason why is becuase of the skimmer being off. Everything was going great until I woke up on Day 8. All of sudden my angel had milky skin and film cover over his eye. I'm not even sure what it was. By the end of the day he was gone. I checked my parameters right away and the ammonia was slightly higher at 0.25.

I turned on my skimmer to help the water issue. For the past two days the skimmer been running wild. It just produces a ton of bubbles and no skim. Any one know how to get my Reef Octopus 150 skimmer back to normal?

 

[KathyC]

DAY 10 on Microbe-lift Herbtana.

The good news is that as of rigth now the Ich issue is gone.
The bad news is I lost my Koran Angel. I feel the reason why is becuase of the skimmer being off. Everything was going great until I woke up on Day 8. All of sudden my angel had milky skin and film cover over his eye. I'm not even sure what it was. By the end of the day he was gone. I checked my parameters right away and the ammonia was slightly higher at 0.25.

I turned on my skimmer to help the water issue. For the past two days the skimmer been running wild. It just produces a ton of bubbles and no skim. Any one know how to get my Reef Octopus 150 skimmer back to normal?

Sorry for your loss

Milky skin and film over his eye could possibly be a bacterial issue that would be a secondary infection that overwhelmed the fish. It could have possibly entered the fish either through a wound or more likely where the ich parasite created an opening. Remember our tanks are full of all kinds of bacteria and in an unhealthy fish they can overwhelm quickly at times.

As far as no sign of Ich at Day 10 - that would be expected due to the life-cycle of the parasite you are currently in that will last 3 - 28 more days. The Tomont stage is where the ich is reproducing in your substrate (not on the fish) Now would be an EXCELLENT time to vacuum your sand to lessen the number of future parasites that will hatch soon!

As far as your skimmer...I'm sure water changes will help get this squared away. While Microbelift does not publish a list of the ingredients that are in Herbtana, the smell of it (yes, I have a sample bottle here) is remarkably similar to floor cleaner and they often contain some sort of an 'oil' (like primafix & melafix do) and that is probably what is making your skimmer crazy and not performing.
Do you plan to try and remove the Herbtana from your tank soon or are you continuing to add more of it?

 

[Thales]

DAY 10 on Microbe-lift Herbtana.

The good news is that as of rigth now the Ich issue is gone.
The bad news is I lost my Koran Angel. I feel the reason why is becuase of the skimmer being off. Everything was going great until I woke up on Day 8. All of sudden my angel had milky skin and film cover over his eye. I'm not even sure what it was. By the end of the day he was gone. I checked my parameters right away and the ammonia was slightly higher at 0.25.

Sorry for your loss. Sadly, I think this is a combination of a secondary infection and using an unknown 'treatment' - we have no idea what is in the product you have been dosing. It could easily be that the medication did nothing for the infection and it got worse and, we'll, here we are. It also seems like the 'treatment' may not be as reef safe as we would all like it to be.

I turned on my skimmer to help the water issue. For the past two days the skimmer been running wild. It just produces a ton of bubbles and no skim. Any one know how to get my Reef Octopus 150 skimmer back to normal?

Big water changes. Get the 'treatment' out of the tanks, and I wouldn't add any more of it to your tank.

 

[IamRobG]

I lost my Blue Throat Trigger to my ICH battle so far. I still have all 5 other fish that are now healthy and have seemed to beaten the ich. I'm on the 4th week this week and now they're all ICH free so hopefully they developed an immunity to it.

Like Thales said, the best bet is a lot of water changes. I had my skimmer running on full blast for about 4 hours after the Herbtana treatment and i did 2 25% water changes just to get it back to normal.

 

[Stackbundles]

Thanks. I'm finished with the Microbe-lift Herbtana. I feel bad for my angel. He passed so suddenly and quick. I plan on doing a 30% water change tonight.

Thanks Kathy for the advise on vacuuming the sand. Thats a good idea.

 

[KathyC]

You might want to get a Poly-Pad (not the fluffy stuff but the actual pad) in there to help remove whatever is in that product so your skimmer starts to work again

..and don't forget the carbon, THAT is your best friend to clean your water up!