Does it make sence to you??

[Anonymous]

Then this thread helped to save the reefs of the world!

Louey

 

[GSchiemer]

Thanks for elaborating Dustin.

To add to what Dustin said, I recall when wild-caught Pseudochromis fridmani retailed for $90! P. aldabraensis were not far behind. P. splendens were unattainable. The availability of captive-bred specimens helped bring prices DOWN!

Greg

 

[Len]

I just said that if they were going to come at this from a conservation point of view then they should look at the whole picture and make other adjustments in their lives that would include helping other species from our oceans that are under just as much pressure. The fact that this pressure is not being generated by the hobby is irrelevent.

Certain species aren't yet breedable. With enough time and research, perhaps some day more species can be commercially bred at the wholesale level, but not at this present time.

It is perfectly relevent for breeders to care about the demand side of economics.

Are you trying to tell me there's no profit motive anywhere in this? I don't find anything wrong with making a profit what I have a problem with is being charged double for what would be essentially the same product. If there's no profit motive there then I've truly embarrassed and must apologize once again.

It is not unreasonble for breeders to care about the bottom line. Resources must be present to sustain their efforts. The point being made by Dustin, Greg, et. al. is none of these breeders are charging outrageous premiums for their premium products. Fact is, most captive bred fish are on par or less then wild caught alternatives.

 

[Len]

Thanks for elaborating Dustin.

To add to what Dustin said, I recall when wild-caught Pseudochromis fridmani retailed for $90! P. aldabraensis were not far behind. P. splendens were unattainable. The availability of captive-bred specimens helped bring prices DOWN!

Greg

I bought my first P.splendens 6-7 years ago for $200. They're bred for $30 now. That says volumes about motive.

 

[DustinDorton]

No one here will tell you that we are doing this only to save the reefs. ORA is here to make a profit. It is undeniable that the service we provide the hobby is helping to save the reefs. Is it wrong to make a profit and do something good at the same time?

 

[Anonymous]

It is not unreasonble for breeders to care about the bottom line. Resources must be present to sustain their efforts.

Exactly. There's a ton of research going on at UCDavis on sex determination in sturgeon.....mostly because farms will pay enormous amounts of money to to find out how to raise all female stocks of sturgeon.

 

[DOGMAI]

Wow never did I think my topic would get this much attention. Do I get a prize or something. Glad to see everybody is having fun with this. It took three pages but you guys stoped finally talking about me.

 

[danmhippo]

Dude, it's actually 4 (pages.....)

 

[Len]

Gimme your address, dogmai, and I'll send you a shiny quarter That's all I got for being an admin too, if that makes you feel any better

This is definitely a great topic for discussion. I'm confident no one here meant to disparage you, but they were being very candid with some of the ideas that were presented here. Perhaps a bit too brutally honest

 

[Anonymous]

So, I take it that DustinDorton is part of ORA??

That is just great. It is really helpful to the forum to have people from all sides join the discussion. I think it really helps further understanding when the final consumer(me) and the middle men(fish Stores) and the people who raise or catch the fish can all get together.

thanks for a great discussion

Bryan

 

[Expos Forever]

I understand why it is important to state the distinction between a for-profit and non-profit company. A for-profit company will generally focus on fish with a balance of ease of breeding (cost) and demand (with the best example probably being the beloved clownfish). If Phizer found a cure for cancer would anyone begrudge them making a few bucks? There has to be a reasonable expectation to make a reasonable profit for someone to risk money on a business venture. If I could reasonably support my family by propogating corals or raising fish I would jump at the oppurtunity. Pretty hard to make a living selling frags people want to pay 5$-10$ for. Any who attempt , especially on a big enough scale to make a real difference, are noble in my book.

The main reason I will buy captive raised if available, and from ORA specifically, is so that it may become economically feasible to breed more difficult species. For example if it were not for ORA, I doubt that captive raised fish would not be available to canadians at all, except through local hobbiest breeders.

The best thing that could happen to the hobby would be for companies like ORA to make millions- inspiring both competition and innovation. Isn't the goal a completely impact-free hobby?

 

[DustinDorton]

Yes Knucklehead, I have been with ORA for a little more than 2 years now. I manage the coral production for the company.

Save_the_Expos, I couldnt agree with your post more. When people are told that ORA is non-profit, they tend to assume that the government is somehow funding it. Your right, the success of ORA will no doubt allow us to work with new and more challenging species.