Etail/AMDA

[MaryHM]

Is it just me, or does this NEW AMDA speech reek of a REEFORM speech I heard not too long ago??? Geez Wayne, there is no NEW AMDA. Remember those people called members that the BOD is planning on polling about the future direction of AMDA? Until that's done, there's no NEW AMDA. Just a lot of dicussion (worthwhile) about possible directions. Kind of like when MAC put out that memo about cyanide testing and you declared the world saved. Memos are fine and dandy, but until actual action takes place there's no room for declaring "new and improved". In order to create these new changes, AMDA is going to have to completely reorganize and completely rework their bylaws. And they're going to have to have a BOD favorable on working on the specifics after the elections roll around in a few months. I've followed AMDA through 3 presidents now. Each one had an agenda. Each agenda was completely ignored and dropped by the next president. AMDA has a bad name in the industry. If they're going to do a turn around, in addition to changing the policies and bylaws, I think I'd suggest a name change. I've been the person calling the renewing members and asking for their checks. Ain't fun. Sad when a lousy $50 sticker is a hard sell.

Christmas Islands coral??? Where can I get my greedy etailing hands on some of that???!!! :lol:

 

[naesco]

Is it just me, or does this NEW AMDA speech reek of a REEFORM speech I heard not too long ago??? Geez Wayne, there is no NEW AMDA. Remember those people called members that the BOD is planning on polling about the future direction of AMDA? Until that's done, there's no NEW AMDA. Just a lot of dicussion (worthwhile) about possible directions. Kind of like when MAC put out that memo about cyanide testing and you declared the world saved. Memos are fine and dandy, but until actual action takes place there's no room for declaring "new and improved". In order to create these new changes, AMDA is going to have to completely reorganize and completely rework their bylaws. And they're going to have to have a BOD favorable on working on the specifics after the elections roll around in a few months. I've followed AMDA through 3 presidents now. Each one had an agenda. Each agenda was completely ignored and dropped by the next president. AMDA has a bad name in the industry. If they're going to do a turn around, in addition to changing the policies and bylaws, I think I'd suggest a name change. I've been the person calling the renewing members and asking for their checks. Ain't fun. Sad when a lousy $50 sticker is a hard sell.

Christmas Islands coral??? Where can I get my greedy etailing hands on some of that???!!! :lol:

I am happy that you now realize that the changes AMDA is making are going to take some time. Only than will you get firm answers to the questions you posed early in this thread.

I agree that the NEW AMDA needs a new name. How about NAMDA
North American Marine Dealers Association. Canadian B&Ms could join as well.
I guess the manner in which I post is pretty consistant. Mind you, so are your postings.

 

[Fish World1]

Fish
As Mary quite correctly pointed out, I do not speak for AMDA and certainly nothing anyone here has posted implies that you cannot buy from whomever you want to.

In your previous post you said:

"The NEW AMDA will purchase their critters from their own wholesaler or wholesalers that do not etail. It does not make business sense to line the pockets of those who compete with you."

From that statement I would deduce that since Mary e-tails (which doesn't bother me at all) I couldn't or shouldn't buy from her. I'm not going to be a part of an organization if I don't follow it's rules.

I know this is only discussion at this point and nothing is set in stone but it seems to me the "New AMDA" wants to tell me how I can sell (i.e no e-tailing) and who I can buy from. I'll wait for this to play out before I decide rather to join or not.

I'm still sending a check to buy some netting. That's the important thing to me.

 

[Anonymous]

Wayne speaks Wayne's opinions and Wayne's opinions only. This is not an AMDA sactioned or "approved" event. The opinions here are just that. Opinions and discussion. If you have specific questions about AMDA please send one of us an email.

 

[nanocat]

... Same thing with my nano-packs. It's stuff I was throwing away because no retailer wanted it. Now I can save it. And that's where our etail focus is going- nanopacks and aquacultured corals

I paid $75 for stuff you were throwing away? You dawg, you
Just joking, I loved my nano pak, and I'd venture to say practically everyone I've spoken to about it has ordered one too. It's a great deal, and a very good niche IMO.

Still giggling over the comment that e-tailing isn't here for the long haul. What rock does that guy live under? :lol:

 

[dizzy]

Still giggling over the comment that e-tailing isn't here for the long haul. What rock does that guy live under? :lol:

nanocat,
Since your reading comprehension level is obviously below normal I'll break it down in more simplistic terms for you. I very clearly stated that I believe the future of etail will be aquacultured livestock. I stated that only producers would be players. Is that really so hard for you to understand? I believe the etailing of discounted marine livestock will expedite the end of the wild harvest. If etailing of wild collected livestock survives it will be greatly restricted and only a few powerful companies will monopolize the supply. In terms you can understand that means it will speed up the time in which laws are passed to shut down the importation of wild caught marinelife. Prolly not a big issue for a nano tank guy, but one that will have serious consequences for the brick and mortars retailers, none the less. If I was you I'd get that giggling disorder checked out. :lol:

Mary I was wondering how you know so much about the LA wholesaler's ties to etailing? I thought that group didn't like each other enough to exhange personal business information like that. Even if there is some form of unity between the white boys, I doubt it extends to the Asian wholesalers. If memory serves none of them were involved in meeting when the wholesalers were going to take over AMDA. If none of the current group of wholesalers wants to cater to the brick and mortar retailers, then perhaps someone new will emerge that does. Someone new just recently set up on 104th to go direct to hobbyists. If someone can do that, there is no reason to believe that someone can't do something similar to service the disgruntled b&m. If I was you I wouldn't pay too much attention to the current AMDA membership list. Wait until the editorials start running in dealers publications before judging the impact a united dealers organization can have. Our drygoods wholesalers have agreed to help get the new message out to our fellow retailers, as there are also negatively affected. I can't believe you don't understand what a serious issue this is, I can assure you every retail member of the AMDA BOD feels like their business is threatened. If I was a wholesaler I would seriously consider changing my ways so I could be attractive to this new group of consumers.
Mitch

 

[Anonymous]

Could have done without the personal jabs.

 

[JennM]

I just have one question for Wayne...

If "New AMDA" is so hell-bent on excluding wholesalers and being only for the retailer... why is it being led by a president who is a wholesaler?

I admire and support the IDEAS behind the current AMDA leadership's efforts, however the sins of the past aren't fast to fade away, and Mary's right... each change of leadership has resulted in a change of direction for the entity. At this point, few in the industry are likely to take it seriously anyway.

I'm not being defeatist... just realistic, and reluctant to throw my cash into the ring where it might just go nowhere. In my experience, joining these groups (and I've joined a bunch of them) are just paying people to pat themselves on the back and have "free" rubber chicken dinner now and then to justify the fee... been there, done that, not doing it again until I can see value in my dollar. That's no disrespect to Steve or the current BOD of AMDA, that's just been my overall experience in industry related associations. If there is a "different" one out there, I'm not likely to find it or join it because I've already been there, done that with no return on my dollar for those I did join.

If I see the next AMDA president keep running with the same ball, I might reconsider... but for now I'll watch from the sidelines, and be there "in spirit".

The best $50 I spent was on the netting fund... at least I know that went where it was needed and wanted and useful... and quality livestock brought in is a wonderful return on my investment.

Jenn

 

[dizzy]

Glenn,
Take a look at who drew first blood. That comment prolly would have been more appropriate prior to my post.
Mitch

 

[dizzy]

I'm not being defeatist... just realistic, and reluctant to throw my cash into the ring where it might just go nowhere. In my experience, joining these groups (and I've joined a bunch of them) are just paying people to pat themselves on the back and have "free" rubber chicken dinner now and then to justify the fee... been there, done that, not doing it again until I can see value in my dollar. Jenn

Jenn no one gets paid to serve on the BOD of AMDA. We have paid Steve's way when he speaking about the net issues at MO and such. We also sent him to PI to report on the current state of affairs. Both were no frills cheap fares. AMDA needs members who are willing to help themselves to some degree. Ask not what AMDA can do for you, ask what you can do for AMDA.
Mitch

 

[naesco]

Jenn as pointed out I do not speak for AMDA, know nothing about its inner workings and little about its past history.

What I do know. I figured out.

You need an organization that will represent you. You need an organization that will provide quality fish, choice fish at great prices.

You need a level playing field to compete with etail/wholesalers (EWs); EWs that invest and promote etail. EWs that sell direct to hobbyists.
It has already been stated that the LA gals/guys get to cherry pick and you get the raisons.

A buying group has been the Saviour of many B&M shops in other retail and there is no reason why it would not work here.

I agree with the previous post. LFS like yours need to be the first in line to support the NEW AMDA (my words and I am going to continue to use them). As Steve has already indicated that his interest in the environmental side of AMDA, you need to find a President who has the vision and the time to see it through and a working BOD who supports his efforts.

Think the opportunities Jenn. The buying group could arrange exclusivity with suppliers from the Christmas Islands (by way of example). Their fish would only be available to the NEW AMDA. First class fish at great prices that you could sell to premiere hobbyists at generous markups without competion from EWs. Available North East and South (Everyone is a chrry picker.)
Good Luck.

 

[Anonymous]

so if amda's competition's answer to all this is to lowball even further, what then?

is amda then responsible for the 'rape and pillage' ?

i'd just suggest you choose your battles wisely

 

[clarionreef]

Jenn,
There would be no insertion of the proper netting into the equation without the netting being defined and front-loaded as an issue early last year...by us.
There would be no real barrier netting in the hands of divers now all over Bali if not for the AMDA initiative...and expense to put it out there over the concerns of those that thought that it might embarrass MAC.
Obviously, this AMDA is very different then the last.
The NET FUND does not run itself nor does it deploy and train anyone by itself. Its simply a way to help define and promulgate the issue. Regardless of a FUND, we would have bought and brought the netting anyway.
Steve

 

[clarionreef]

Vitz, et al.
Before you repond to a free-lance hobbyists gameplan for AMDA, please check w/ us first.
He means well...but hes from, er...Canada...you know, next to France.
Steve
PS. Why not start a CAMDA up there Wayne?

 

[naesco]

so if amda's competition's answer to all this is to lowball even further, what then?

is amda then responsible for the 'rape and pillage' ?

i'd just suggest you choose your battles wisely

The rape and pillage comes from Etail/Wholesale (EW) that bring in tonnes and tonnes of cheap cyanide caught Philiippine and Indonesian fish and sell them to unsuspecting newbies at apparently cheap prices only to have them die in their tanks.

An AMDA wholesaler would have the ability to negotiate healthy specimens at great prices from the suppliers. In effect the AMDA wholesaler would be the cherry picker for all of you.
After all it makes no difference to the EW because his customers can't see what they are buying anyway.

 

[naesco]

Vitz, et al.
Before you repond to a free-lance hobbyists gameplan for AMDA, please check w/ us first.
He means well...but hes from, er...Canada...you know, next to France.
Steve
PS. Why not start a CAMDA up there Wayne?

:lol: next to France!
CAMDA you mean the Canadian-American .................... OK

I not only mean well, I make sense, right? Mr. Presidente

Truthfully, though, the more members, the more buying clout. An international effort would be mutually rewarding.

 

[clarionreef]

Amda is an issue oriented focus group that adresses issues for the general good of the trade...and the dealers membership.
Sustainable collecting practice is for the good of the trade...and the membership.

It is not a dealers version of a hobbyist buying club. It is not a chamber of commerce for a select group of retailers. If members want to unite for various commercial reasons...I guess they could as a side project as MAC has already done w/ its good ol boys 'certified' clique, but that is not what our mission statement is all about...If it evolves into that it'll be without me I'm sure.


Steve

 

[naesco]

Jenn,
There would be no insertion of the proper netting into the equation without the netting being defined and front-loaded as an issue early last year...by us.
There would be no real barrier netting in the hands of divers now all over Bali if not for the AMDA initiative...and expense to put it out there over the concerns of those that thought that it might embarrass MAC.
Obviously, this AMDA is very different then the last.
The NET FUND does not run itself nor does it deploy and train anyone by itself. Its simply a way to help define and promulgate the issue. Regardless of a FUND, we would have bought and brought the netting anyway.
Steve

I think the money would flow one hundred fold for these efforts under a NEW AMDA Steve.
1. A huge membership brings in huge dollars.
2. The AMDA wholesalers profits could be reinvested in these initiatives rather than line the pockets of the EWs.
3. A united strong AMDA would attract dollars to its environmental efforts from those who want to see a proactive approach .

 

[naesco]

Amda is an issue oriented focus group that adresses issues for the general good of the trade...and the dealers membership.
Sustainable collecting practice is for the good of the trade...and the membership.

It is not a dealers version of a hobbyist buying club. It is not a chamber of commerce for a select group of retailers. If members want to unite for various commercial reasons...I guess they could as a side project as MAC has already done w/ its good ol boys 'certified' clique, but that is not what our mission statement is all about...If it evolves into that it'll be without me I'm sure.

Why, Steve? See my earlier post. Everyone benefits.

 

[clarionreef]

Then the new president will have to be a philanthropic business manager...
not a diver. I'm going back in the water soon.
Steve